Template talk:Did you know

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For instructions on how to nominate an article, see below.
"Did you know...?"
Supplementary rulesWP:DYKSG
Noms (awaiting approval)WP:DYKN
Reviewing guideWP:DYKR
Noms (approved)WP:DYKNA
Preps & QueuesT:DYK/Q
Currently on Main Page
Main Page errorsWP:ERRORS
Archive of DYKsWP:DYKA
April 1 hooksWP:DYKAPRIL
April 1 talkWT:DYKAPRIL

This page is to nominate fresh articles to appear in the "Did you know" section on the Main Page, by a "hook" (an interesting note). Nominations that have been approved are moved to a staging area, from which the articles are promoted into the Queue.


Count of DYK Hooks
Section # of Hooks # Verified
August 6 1
September 12 1
September 23 1
September 25 2
October 2 2
October 3 1
October 8 1
October 9 1
October 10 2 1
October 12 2 1
October 13 1
October 14 1
October 15 1
October 16 2 1
October 17 1
October 18 2 1
October 21 4
October 22 2
October 23 3 2
October 24 4 1
October 25 2 1
October 27 1
October 28 2 1
October 29 2 2
October 30 4 2
October 31 3 2
November 1 5 5
November 2 5 4
November 3 3 3
November 4 7 5
November 5 6 5
November 6 3 3
November 7 2 2
November 8 7 5
November 9 11 7
November 10 5 5
November 11 6 5
November 12 4 4
November 13 1 1
November 14 8 6
November 15 13 13
November 16 6 4
November 17 21 13
November 18 11 10
November 19 10 7
November 20 8 6
November 21 8 4
November 22 5 3
November 23 10 4
November 24 9 3
November 25 11 6
November 26 8 5
November 27 6 3
November 28 7 6
November 29 8 5
November 30 7 4
December 1 15 7
December 2 6 2
December 3 12 6
December 4 14 5
December 5 15 5
December 6 10 3
December 7 2
December 8 7 4
December 9 7 2
December 10 6 1
Total 364 206
Last updated 22:24, 10 December 2018 UTC
Current time is 22:25, 10 December 2018 UTC [refresh]

Instructions for nominators

Create a subpage for your new DYK suggestion and then list the page below under the date the article was created or the expansion began or it became a good article (not the date you submit it here), with the newest dates at the bottom. Any registered user may nominate a DYK suggestion (if you are not a registered user, please leave a message at the bottom of the DYK project talk page with the details of the article you would like to nominate and the hook you would like to propose); self-nominations are permitted and encouraged. Thanks for participating and please remember to check back for comments on your nomination (consider watchlisting your nomination page).

If this is your first nomination, please read the DYK rules before continuing:
Official DYK criteria: DYK rules and supplementary guidelines
Unofficial guide: Learning DYK

To nominate an article

Read these instructions completely before proceeding.
For simplified instructions, see User:Rjanag/Quick DYK 2.
Create the nomination subpage.

Enter the article title in the box below and click the button. (To nominate multiple articles together, enter any or all of the article titles.) You will then be taken to a preloaded nomination page.

Write the nomination.

On the nomination page, fill in the relevant information. See Template:NewDYKnomination and {{NewDYKnomination/guide}} for further information.

  • Not every line of the template needs to be filled in. For instance, if you are not nominating an image to appear with your hook, there is no need to fill in the image-related lines.
  • Add an edit summary e.g. "Nominating YOUR ARTICLE TITLE for DYK" and click Save page.
  • Make sure the nomination page is on your watchlist, so you can follow the review discussion.

In the current nominations section find the subsection for the date on which the article was created or on which expansion began (or, if a new Good Article, the date on which it became a GA), not the date on which you make the nomination.

  • At the top of that subsection (before other nominations already there, but below the section head and hidden comment) add {{Did you know nominations/YOUR ARTICLE TITLE}}.
  • Add an edit summary e.g. "Nominating YOUR ARTICLE TITLE for DYK" and click Save page.
  • Consider adding {{Did you know nominations/YOUR ARTICLE TITLE}} to the article's talk page (without a section heading‍—‌the template adds a section heading automatically).

How to review a nomination

Any editor who was not involved in writing/expanding or nominating an article may review it by checking to see that the article meets all the DYK criteria (long enough, new enough, no serious editorial or content issues) and the hook is cited. Editors may also alter the suggested hook to improve it, suggest new hooks, or even lend a hand and make edits to the article to which the hook applies so that the hook is supported and accurate. For a more detailed discussion of the DYK rules and review process see the supplementary guidelines and the WP:Did you know/Reviewing guide.

To post a comment or review on a DYK nomination, follow the steps outlined below:

  • Look through this page, Template talk:Did you know, to find a nomination you would like to comment on.
  • Click the "Review or comment" link at the top of the nomination. You will be taken to the nomination subpage.
  • The top of the page includes a list of the DYK criteria. Check the article to ensure it meets all the relevant criteria.
  • To indicate the result of the review (i.e., whether the nomination passes, fails, or needs some minor changes), leave a signed comment on the page. Please begin with one of the 5 review symbols that appear at the top of the edit screen, and then indicate all aspects of the article that you have reviewed; your comment should look something like the following:

    Article length and age are fine, no copyvio or plagiarism concerns, reliable sources are used. But the hook needs to be shortened.

    If you are the first person to comment on the nomination, there will be a line :* <!-- REPLACE THIS LINE TO WRITE FIRST COMMENT, KEEPING :* --> showing you where you should put the comment.
  • Save the page.

If there is any problem or concern about a nomination, please consider notifying the nominator by placing {{subst:DYKproblem|Article|header=yes|sig=yes}} on the nominator's talk page.

Frequently asked questions


This page is often backlogged. As long as your submission is still on the page, it will stay there until an editor reviews it. Since editors are encouraged to review the oldest submissions first (so that those hooks don't grow stale), it may take several weeks until your submission is reviewed. In the meantime, please consider reviewing another submission (not your own) to help reduce the backlog (see instructions above).

Where is my hook?

If you can't find the nomination you submitted to this nominations page, it may have been approved and is on the approved nominations page waiting to be promoted. It could also have been added to one of the prep areas, promoted from prep to a queue, or is on the main page.

If the nominated hook is in none of those places, then the nomination has probably been rejected. Such a rejection usually only occurs if it was at least a couple of weeks old and had unresolved issues for which any discussion had gone stale. If you think your nomination was unfairly rejected, you can query this on the DYK discussion page, but as a general rule such nominations will only be restored in exceptional circumstances.

Search archived DYK nomination discussions

Instructions for other editors

How to promote an accepted hook

  • See Wikipedia:Did you know/Preparation areas for full instructions.
  • Hooks that have been approved are located on the approved nominations page.
  • In one window, open the DYK nomination subpage of the hook you would like to promote.
  • In another window, open the prep set you intend to add the hook to.
  • In the prep set...
    • Paste the hook into the hook area (be sure to not paste in that that)
    • Paste the credit information ({{DYKmake}} and/or {{DYKnom}}) into the credits area.
    • Add an edit summary, e.g. "Promoted [[Jane Fonda]]", preview, and save
  • Back on DYK nomination page...
    • change {{DYKsubpage to {{subst:DYKsubpage
    • change |passed= to |passed=yes
    • Add an edit summary, e.g. "Promoted to Prep 3", preview, and save

How to remove a rejected hook

  • Open the DYK nomination subpage of the hook you would like to remove. (It's best to wait several days after a reviewer has rejected the hook, just in case someone contests or the article undergoes a large change.)
  • In the window where the DYK nomination subpage is open, replace the line {{DYKsubpage with {{subst:DYKsubpage, and replace |passed= with |passed=no. Then save the page. This has the effect of wrapping up the discussion on the DYK nomination subpage in a blue archive box and stating that the nomination was unsuccessful, as well as adding the nomination to a category for archival purposes.

How to remove a hook from the prep areas or queue

  • Edit the prep area or queue where the hook is and remove the hook and the credits associated with it.
  • Go to the hook's nomination subpage (there should have been a link to it in the credits section).
    • View the edit history for that page
    • Go back to the last version before the edit where the hook was promoted, and revert to that version to make the nomination active again.
    • Add a new icon on the nomination subpage to cancel the previous tick and leave a comment after it explaining that the hook was removed from the prep area or queue, and why, so that later reviewers are aware of this issue.
  • Add a transclusion of the template back to this page so that reviewers can see it. It goes under the date that it was first created/expanded/listed as a GA. You may need to add back the day header for that date if it had been removed from this page.
  • If you removed the hook from a queue, it is best to either replace it with another hook from one of the prep areas, or to leave a message at WT:DYK asking someone else to do so.

How to move a nomination subpage to a new name

  • Don't; it should not ever be necessary, and will break some links which will later need to be repaired. Even if you change the title of the article, you don't need to move the nomination page.


Older nominations

Articles created/expanded on August 6

Claus Leininger

Musiktheater im Revier
Musiktheater im Revier

Created by Gerda Arendt (talk). Self-nominated at 16:34, 13 August 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol confirmed.svg Article is new enough, long enough and within policy regarding neutrality, sourcing and close paraphrasing. The image is licensed and a good illustration. Volcanoguy 02:59, 25 August 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol possible vote.svg Returned from prep for further work on the hook per discussion at WT:DYK. Perhaps something hooky could be written about the subject himself. Yoninah (talk) 22:51, 30 August 2018 (UTC)
  • @Yoninah: Would the original hook work if "Ruhr-Scala" was pipe-linked as "Ruhr-Scala"? I just checked the article and unfortunately there's not really much else that's hook-worthy from the content, so we might need to work on this hook. @Gerda Arendt: Some questions about the article: in the lede section, is "profil" intentional or a typo of "profile"? Also, is there no information about what happened between his retirement and death? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 01:46, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
He made a house at an impossible culture-less place (Ruhr) a success (La Scala), - I thought it was a brief summary. Yes, a typo, and don't mention the most unusual, contemporary opera, because we had it already, - some wordsmith, please. - No reason to say anything about his retirement if he possible simply enjoyed it ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:16, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
  • I think the hook would work if you explained it. I added something to the article along those lines: Alluding to La Scala, the house was nicknamed Ruhr-Scala at the time, reflecting its cultural offerings in what was essentially an industrial zone. If that was sourced somehow, we could have:
  • ALT2: ... that during Claus Leininger's tenure as general manager of the Musiktheater im Revier (pictured), the theatre was nicknamed "Ruhr-Scala" for upgrading the cultural offerings of what was essentially an industrial zone? Yoninah (talk) 09:50, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
Symbol confirmed.svg That's a much better hook, since the explanation adds to the hookiness (i.e. the contrasts between culture and being an industrial zone). To be honest, I had concerns about the original hook when promoting it, but had good faith that perhaps others could find it interesting. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 10:10, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
  • Comment: Symbol possible vote.svg This was pulled by Fram in a now archived DYK talk page discussion about issues with the article. I did what Fram should have done and that is to reopen the discussion and now I will re-add it back to the nominations page. SL93 (talk) 15:48, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
(ec) The thread is at Wikipedia talk:Did you know/Archive 153#Two hooks removed from Prep 5 (probably the next queue to hit the main page), - the concern being that the explanation is not sourced in the article. My 2ct: it's only an explanation for the hook without context, explaining what the links to Ruhr and La Scala provide anyway. I offered an ALT, to no avail so far:
ALT3: ... that when Claus Leininger was general manager of the Musiktheater im Revier (pictured), he won international opera singers to perform there?
Revier is a colloquial term for the Ruhr district along the Ruhr river, btw. The name of the theatre is a program. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:10, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
ps: best to have it pictured, to show that it isn't the typical opera house ;) - The first hook was approved in August, - it's perhaps the nom with the longest time between approval and appearance. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:14, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
... only that the history is short, 1959 ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:00, 4 December 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on September 12

Timeline of Cluj-Napoca

1617 engraving of Cluj/Kolozsvár/Klausenburg by Joris Hoefnagel.
1617 engraving of Cluj/Kolozsvár/Klausenburg by Joris Hoefnagel.
  • ... that throughout its long timeline the city of Cluj-Napoca was part of many empires and kingdoms, including Roman Empire, Hungarian Kingdom, Habsburg Monarchy, Austria-Hungary and Kingdom of Romania ...? Source: "MacKendrick, Paul Lachlan (2000). The Dacian Stones Speak. Routledge Monographs in Classical Studies (illustrated, reprint ed.). Chapel Hill: University of North Carolina Press."; Source: "Lukács, József (2005). Povestea "oraşului-comoară": scurtă istorie a Clujului şi a monumentelor sale [The story of the "treasure-city": a short history of Cluj and its monuments] (in Romanian). Levente Várdai. Cluj-Napoca: Apostrof. ISBN 978-973-9279-74-1. "

5x expanded by Codrinb (talk). Self-nominated at 20:00, 12 September 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol delete vote.svg Not eligible. List articles must have at least 1,500 characters of readable prose in order to qualify for DYK. Catrìona (talk) 05:44, 16 September 2018 (UTC)
Symbol possible vote.svg This appears to be only the nominator's fifth nomination, and given that the article itself is long (the problem is that the content is presented as a list while DYK's length requirement only applies to prose), this could still work as a hook. @Codrinb: I would suggest you expand the lede section to be a summary of the whole article, ensuring that it is at least 1,500 characters. Once this is done, this can become DYK eligible. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 05:00, 21 September 2018 (UTC)
Hi all. Thank you for the feedback. I put a lot of work into this article and I will be happy to make anything that is necessary to make it eligible. Thank you for giving me a chance, @Narutolovehinata5:. The main reason for not expanding the lead more is to keep it "in sync" and consistent with all the other articles in Category:Timelines of cities in Europe. If you look at Timeline of London or Timeline of Frankfurt, they have a similar lead. If you think that I should deviate from this, in order to achieve DYK, I will do it. I will also ping @M2545: and other users involved with such lists, perhaps there are other examples of DYK or longer leads. Thanks! Codrin.B (talk) 10:32, 23 September 2018 (UTC)
Hi again, I have added a new lead as requested. Please let me know if this works. Thanks. Codrin.B (talk) 12:38, 23 September 2018 (UTC)
To try and help push the DYK along I have edited the article's lead. It is now at 1,623 characters. I hope that helps! --Elonka 22:47, 25 November 2018 (UTC)

Hook eligiblity:

  • Cited: Green tickY - Offline/paywalled citation accepted in good faith
  • Interesting: Green tickY
  • Other problems: Red XN - The grammar in the hook is weird. Roman Empire needs a definite article, as do some of the others.

Image eligibility:

QPQ: None required.

Overall: Symbol question.svg Is this one of your first five DYK noms? Catrìona (talk) 06:40, 24 September 2018 (UTC)

@Catrìona: This is the nominator's fifth nomination so no QPQ is necessary yet; however, their next DYK and beyond will require a QPQ. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 07:30, 24 September 2018 (UTC)
Thanks for the feedback. What is QPQ? ;-) How about this text and new image:
Cluj coat of arms, awarded in 1377.

Codrin.B: I would accept that if the caption were significantly shorter. 8 lines is too many. Catrìona (talk) 04:19, 29 September 2018 (UTC)

Hi @Catrìona:. I removed less important aspects from the lead and kept the core ideas. The lead is now around 1800 characters. I hope this is acceptable. Thanks.Codrin.B (talk) 06:25, 30 September 2018 (UTC)
Ah, you were talking about the image caption... I never intended it to be so long. I just added the image previously with the caption I used elsewhere. To goal was to check if this image is better. I trimmed down the caption as well now. Codrin.B (talk) 06:30, 30 September 2018 (UTC)
Symbol confirmed.svg I recommend the wording "throughout its long history" rather than "throughout its long timeline". Catrìona (talk) 06:34, 30 September 2018 (UTC)
The reason I used "timeline" is to differentiate from the History of Cluj-Napoca article, which I might also work on to get it to a DYK, and also to be inline with the article title: "Timeline of Cluj-Napoca". But certainly "history" sounds better. I am fine if it has to be changed for the DYK. Thanks. Codrin.B (talk) 10:04, 30 September 2018 (UTC)

Symbol possible vote.svgI'm a little concerned at the amount of unsourced content here. An entry about Hadrian becoming Emperor may not need a source, but an entry about a redlinked individual such as Flavius Italicus does, I'm afraid. Vanamonde (talk) 23:02, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Actually all governors of province Dacia come out of the List of Roman governors of Dacia Traiana which in turn uses this reference: Petolescu, Constantin C. (2014). Dacia: un mileniu de istorie [Dacia: a millennium of history] (in Romanian). Bucharest: Editura Academiei Române. ISBN 978-973-27-2450-7.. I expected that this could be an issue so I started to add individual references for each governor. Thanks for bringing it up. Codrin.B (talk) 22:26, 23 October 2018 (UTC)
@Vanamonde93:, @Catrìona:, @Narutolovehinata5: - I finalized adding references to all legates, procurators and other leaders from 2nd and 3rd century. From my perspective, while it could be further improved, the article is quite well sourced for all the centuries and from a wide variety of sources. Please let me know if there is anything else I can do to make this better and get it approved. Thanks. Codrin.B (talk) 22:09, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol redirect vote 4.svg It's been over two weeks without any of the previous reviewers returning; a new reviewer would be welcome. Many thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 15:24, 24 November 2018 (UTC)
Symbol question.svg - Length, Date, Earwigs, and QPQ exempt check. However while the article has many more citations (thank you Codrin.B for your work here) some of the facts in the hook regretfully do not have cites - for example the city being included in the Treaty of Karlowitz (Hapsburg), being part of Austria-Hungary, and the Hungarian Kingdom. Once those are added/clarified, we should be good to go. Best, Mifter (talk) 23:33, 2 December 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on September 23

Conquest Brigade

Foundation of the Conquest Brigade in 2013
Foundation of the Conquest Brigade in 2013
  • ... that the Conquest Brigade (pictured) was described as "moderate Islamist" group, despite closely cooperating with ISIL and supporting the extermination of a religious minority in Syria? Source: "Noteworthy also from the fall of the Mannagh airbase is a video released by the battalion Liwa al-Fatah, described by one writer as a "moderate Islamist" group. A quick glance at the video quickly demonstrates that in analysis, the term "moderate Islamist" in this context is quite meaningless. First, Abu Jandal al-Masri, the leader of the JMWA contingent--identified immediately by the speaker who filmed the video as synonymous with ISIS--is seen to be embracing a member of Liwa al-Fatah. Abu Jandal then proclaims, "I swear by God we will not leave a single Alawite alive in Syria... state of Islam, state of the Caliphate." This is all proclaimed to the assent of "God is great" from the other fighters, including the Liwa al-Fatah member who filmed the video." (The Islamic State of Iraq and al-Sham, pp. 24, 25)

Created by Applodion (talk). Self-nominated at 19:04, 23 September 2018 (UTC).

QPQ: Done.

Overall: Symbol voting keep.svg You need to include (pictured) somewhere in the hook to attach a picture. Catrìona (talk) 07:08, 24 September 2018 (UTC)

Added "pictured" and QPQ. Applodion (talk) 07:29, 24 September 2018 (UTC)

Symbol possible vote.svg This was pulled from the main page by Stephen due to sourcing issues raised at WP:ERRORS. As the article was up for less than an hour, it probably deserves a second chance, but right now a lot of work needs to be done if this is to return to DYK. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:54, 24 October 2018 (UTC)

@Narutolovehinata5: Frankly, I do not understand the problem. The source is reliable and clear about the issue, and it is inline-sourced. Further sources for the hook are given in the article, for example the Historical Dictionary of Islamic Fundamentalism clearly states that the group's members were "aligning themselves with the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria (ISIS) for a time". Applodion (talk) 10:11, 24 October 2018 (UTC)
As the main criticism was about the hook being too broad, how about: ALT1: ... that the Conquest Brigade (pictured) was described by one writer as "moderate Islamist" group, despite closely cooperating with ISIL and supporting the extermination of a religious minority in Syria? (same source) Applodion (talk) 10:52, 24 October 2018 (UTC)
Well, I have no idea what the "sourcing issues" actually were, but ALT1 seems OK to me because it alleviates the concern about "moderate Islamist" a label that the source criticizes. Catrìona (talk) 16:04, 23 November 2018 (UTC)
The problem was that the editor who reported the "sourcing issues" never replied to my question about what exactly the problem was; another editor suggested that it was due to the original hook not being clear enough. Anyway, I hope that it will be ok this time thanks to the tweak. Applodion (talk) 12:11, 24 November 2018 (UTC)
@Applodion: Have you tried talking to the editor again on what those sourcing issues were? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:43, 26 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on September 25

Heaven for the nobles, Purgatory for the townspeople, Hell for the peasants, and Paradise for the Jews

Created by Pharos (talk) and Piotrus (talk). Nominated by Piotrus (talk) at 11:24, 1 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol voting keep.svg Article is new enough and long enough. So many sources are offline or in different languages that I will blanket AGF on them. It looks like everything is sourced inline. QPQ is done. Hook seems reasonably supported by the article and interesting. Didn't find any plagiarism or copyvio in a few searches. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 18:51, 1 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol redirect vote 4.svg New review needed for ALT1, which was suggested after the discussion at WT:DYK. Yoninah (talk) 16:17, 8 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Comment. ALT1 is not correct. The controversy is about whether the time period can be called a Golden Age for Jews in Poland, or if that exaggerates the situation of the Jews. The controversy is not settled so don't go for one option in Wikipedia's voice. It might be better to go with something like the lead sentence at the Polish version of the page: "Heaven for the nobles, Purgatory for the townspeople, Hell for the peasants, and Paradise for the Jews is a proverb sarcastically describing the society of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth." That sticks to the facts. Please read about the multiple meanings of the proverb here. Then consider whether, with the current worries about anti-semitism in Poland, you want to put this proverb on the main page. StarryGrandma (talk) 01:27, 9 November 2018 (UTC)
  • I am totally ok with ALT2 as proposed by StarryGradnma, I just hope it's not too long. It should contain no controversial facts, nor be in inappropriate tone. For referencing purposes, it is described as a proverb here: [1], and as satirical, here: [2], and neither of those two terms have been disputed on talk. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 06:59, 9 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Note that the Polish wiki article was created (by Piotrus) after this one was created and was edited by Piotrus and one other editors (this edit). There are still serious NPOV issues with the article (and reverts to keep the tag out), and notability/OR concerns for the full phrase (e.g. - the title of the article (present in the hook) - the phrase in this form is not present in any English language source covering this antisemitic proverb). As for what this means, this is - an "anti-Semitic phantasm" per this, a "pasquinade" that is "saying that Jews had it “too good.”" per [3], "'17th-century polemic concept condemning the rampant prevalence of infidels" per [4]. As for modern POV - Piotr Wróbel clearly makes clear the various viewpoints around this - On the one hand, most Poles firmly believe that Poland has always been one of the most tolerant countries in the world and that antiSemitism has existed only on the margins of Polish society. As far as they are concerned, there has been no such phenomenon as Polish anti-Semitism, for Poland has always been a true paradisus Judeorum. On the other hand, most Jews, especially those on the American continent and in Western Europe, claim that Poland is one of the most anti-Semitic countries in the world. Jews have often shared the former Israeli Prime Minister Yitzhak Shamir's belief that virtually all Poles received their anti-Semitism "with their mothers' milk."[5]. This is not merely an "exaggeration" - it was a call for action against the relative (still overall wretched [6]) safety of Jews in Poland (until 1648) vs. the rest of Europe - the "paradise" being the relative lack of persecutions. Icewhiz (talk) 06:11, 9 November 2018 (UTC)
    Icewhiz, with all due respect, what is the point of your rant? Nobody except you supports either the POV or OR claims. You haven't even clearly suggested what POV issues are in the article, as in, you haven't said 'this claim is not-neutral, and this other claim is missing'. We have added the relatively fringe claim (by a minor scholar, in a minor journal) that the expression "Paradise for Jews" is anti-semitic, but it is clear as day that a ton of other scholars and media sources are using it and nobody thinks it is a major issue. Anyway, this is an issue to be discussed on artice's talk, where, I'll note, nobody supports you (so yeah, the tags removed from the article because you are in minority). --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 06:59, 9 November 2018 (UTC)
    I presented 4 sources above, not one, demonstrating the NPOV issue here (here's another - " its title is taken from an anti-Jewish text, which claims that the good living conditions Jews enjoyed in Poland were something that should change" [7]). As for "nobody supports you" -this was pulled from the DYK queue for this reason. You yourself removed the various tags (e.g. here) - without consensus on the talk page for doing so.Icewhiz (talk) 07:17, 9 November 2018 (UTC)
    All the issues / sources you have raised here have been discussed on article's talk, where nobody supports you. Many of your sources and arguments HAVE been incorporated into the text, through there is no consensus for the tags you've added, as nobody besides you wants them re-added - likely because, again, all the issues you've raised have been incorporated in the article. If you dissent against the consensus, well, there's no veto power on Wikipedia, through as I noted on your talk page, you are more than welcome to edit the article yourself. I encourage you, again, to edit the article, as well as to propose a hook that you'd think would be more neutral, if you have concerns about proposed hook ALT1 or ALT2. PS. Since you quote from [8], I will note that your quote is sadly out of context. Interested readers would be well advised to take a look at the entire page 12 of the pdf. To put this in broader context: "...formulated in this manner, the accusation that the authors of the Polin exhibition have not taken into account “modern historical studies,” ignores the immense research fndings and the latest achievements of Jewish historiography... Emblematic here is the criticism against one of the most distinguished experts on the history of Jews in Poland in the modern period, Moshe Rosman. He was accused of “Polinizng” the history of Jews in Poland by promoting a false and ideologized version of it with the myth of Poland as a “paradise of tolerance.”" Long story short, the academic debate about this topic, as well as whether this phrase is anti-semitic, or much more nuanced, is ongoing, and any attempt to simply it is not helpful. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 03:48, 11 November 2018 (UTC)
    There is no disagreement in the academic literature that the full phrase is highly antisemitic. There are however uses of the sub-phrase "Paradisus Judeorum" which are not. As for discussion on the article talk page on POV, I believe it was limited to me and you, and that you yourself removed the tag - despite there being a clear lack of consensus (1 vs. 1) regarding POV. I chose not to engage in edit warring over the tag, despite the removal of the tag being highly irregular. The article has severe NPOV and notability (for the full phrase) issues. Icewhiz (talk) 07:17, 11 November 2018 (UTC)
    That's your OR not backed up by any sources. A single scholar has stated that the two-word part of the proverb, "Jewish Paradise" is antisemitic. Nobody else said this, clearly, about the proverb or that part, instead numerous scholars use it without any reference to anything but the Golden Age of Jews in Poland. Ex. this is Gershon Hundert's use of the proverb and discussion of the related topic Paradisus Judaeorum: A central theme of this paper will be my attempt to diffuse some of the darkness, lachrymosity and sense that the experience of Jews in Poland was of unending pogrom and persecution. I shall argue that this is a story characterized by light and not darkness, by life and not death. If one had to choose a single word to reflect the experience of Jews in Poland, it would be vitality. That and an indomitably positive sense of self. The Polish Jewish community was vibrant, creative, proud and self-confident: sevurim hem deyabashta hava veleika galuta, they thought they were on dry land and not in exile. Their neighbours knew this as well, referring to Poland as Paradisus Judaeorum, rajem dla Zyd6w. The full expression went: 'Poland is heaven for the nobility, hell for the peasants and paradise for Jews'.[4] This is hyperbole of course, but I am emphasizing the brighter side as a corrective to the predominant popular image of the Jewish experience in Polish lands, which seems to me altogether too dismal and to be profoundly coloured by events in the twentieth century. This is my primary goal; my secondary purpose is to complicate your perception. Hundert, Gershon David (1997). "Poland: Paradisus Judaeorum". Journal of Jewish Studies. 48 (2): 335–348. doi:10.18647/2003/JJS-1997. ISSN 0022-2097. Nothing about anti-semitism of the proverb in his discussion. This is the representative use and discussion of the proverb, not the pretty recent and fringe accusation of a single scholar (Janicka) that it is antisemitic. Feel free to publish a paper that it is a "highly antisemitic saying", then we will have a source to consider. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 03:07, 12 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Comment 2 To spell this out more clearly: This Polish proverb comes from the period of increasing feudalism in Poland, with the nobility taking over control of towns and land, worsening conditions for everyone else. It was not meant kindly for either the nobility or the Jews. The proverb links the Jews with the oppressors of the Polish people. At a time of increasing Polish antisemitism I suggest we NOT put this on the main page. StarryGrandma (talk) 08:59, 9 November 2018 (UTC)
  • @StarryGrandma: Please note that WP:NOTCENSORED. If an article is neutral, and the hook is neutral, and the article is eligible, there are no reasons not to put this on the front page. The article is now doing a better job explaining some controversies and issues about this proverb, which should help educate the readers about some aspects of antisemitism. Talking about such issues is better than ignoring them. In fact, I am surprised that my ALT1 hook proposal has not been endorsed by those wary of antisemitic POV, as it explicitly draws attention to this very issue, by pointing out that the proverb is not exactly neutral. ==Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 03:48, 11 November 2018 (UTC)
  • If we are to place a highly antisemtic Polish saying on the main page - quoted in full - it is not sufficient to say it is "exaggerated" or "sarcastic" - we should explicitly spell out that this was an antisemitic polemic saying.Icewhiz (talk) 07:21, 11 November 2018 (UTC)
  • With the note that you are the only person in the world calling this 'a highly antisemitic Polish saying', I am open to reviewing your proposed hook. Just please make sure any claims you make in it are sourced. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 12:01, 11 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Piotrus, Wikipedia is not censored, which is exactly why there are whole categories of articles that never appear on the main page and of images that will never be chosen as featured picture of the day. In this case it is because the topic is currently sensitive and will remain so. And, while in the queue, an American gunman murdered 11 people in a synagogue. The timing would have been unfortunate if the DYK had appeared on Nov 8, so soon afterward. StarryGrandma (talk) 17:37, 11 November 2018 (UTC)
  • @StarryGrandma: I lived in Pittsburgh, I know people who knew people who died there, and I still see no connection between publishing a hook related to Jews and this. There are limits to political correctness, and again, fortunately, Wikipedia is not censored. That said, it is likely this hook won't be on Main Page till December. And in either case, I doubt anyone would really make associations like that, particularly as the anti-semitism in this proverb is very slight. It is a simple exaggeration, and that's a far cry from hate. (Of course, anything can be abused, but this is not our fault). The proverb has been used much more in bening contest than in hate speech; in fact nobody has even shown an example of it being used in modern times in hate speech. You yourself just found a reference I quote above where this proverb is used in a positive context, as reference to vitality of the Jewish culture of the Golden Age of Jews in Poland period. It is exactly this positive association that we should focus on. Instead of worrying about sending a wrong message, we should focus on sending the right one. Something like with an alt that would say that "one of the meanings of the proverb is to reference the Golden Age of Jews in the Middle Ages".--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 03:07, 12 November 2018 (UTC)
  • @StarryGrandma: I like to think that the article that I started is not such toxic antisemitism bait. I think quality articles on Polish-Jewish history are a good thing for the world still, and this is not one of the tropes that has been exploited by the current wave of hate.--Pharos (talk) 05:34, 12 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol delete vote.svg I would pull this nomination. There's an RM going on for the page, as well as a neutrality discussion on the Talk page. Concerns were also expressed at the DYK Talk page here: [9]. It's not suitable for mainpage at this time. --K.e.coffman (talk) 01:11, 10 November 2018 (UTC)
  • I strongly disagree with any suggestion this topic is not legible for a DYK. We should of course wait for RM to finish, as well as to make sure that there is no edit warring and that the article is stable. Unless the topic is deleted, there is no reason for it not to be DYKed, after suitable delay that ensured the article and hook are free of problems. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 03:48, 11 November 2018 (UTC)
  • If the RM is not successful, and the article continues to be on this full phrase which is lacking viable sources (as opposed to the narrower "Paradisus Judeorum" concept which is covered in a secondary manner) - I intend to take this to AfD as a NOTDICTIONARY and GNG fail. Icewhiz (talk) 07:17, 11 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Shrug. There's no deadline, so if you want to waste the community's time with an AfD on that (which is likely, given the RM doesn't have much support), sure. This DYK can wait a few weeks for those issues to be resolved. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 12:00, 11 November 2018 (UTC)
  • NPOV Fail - When editors remove the anti-semitic context of this saying - The term Paradisus Judaeorum [Paradise for Jews] has been present in Polish culture since the 17th century. It comes from an anonymous text expressing anti-gentry and anti-Jewish sentiments, which was published in Latin in 1606 and titled Paskwiliusze na królewskim weselu podrzucone [Lampoons planted at the royal wedding party]. The anonymous writer uses the phrase Paradisus Judaeorum to express his conviction that Poland is ruled by Jews and that they enjoy excessive privileges - from a cited reference [10] supporting the stmt (in a passage filled with 17th, 18th, and 19th century references) - we are repeating hate speech in Wikipedia's voice without context. Icewhiz (talk) 06:20, 12 November 2018 (UTC)
    • This claim wasn't removed - you duplicated it, it was already and is still present in the article, in another section. But your attitude towards a normal copyediting edit ("ITS TRYING TO HIDE ANTISEMITISM") is a good illustration of the issue here. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 07:37, 12 November 2018 (UTC)
      • When anti-X (semitism/Jewish) appears in the article not in the lede, not in the first section, but tucked somewhere in the middle in an attributed manner - this is a shameful state for an article on 17th century hate speech, primarily known for being hate speech. Icewhiz (talk) 07:50, 12 November 2018 (UTC)
        • This is because "17th century hate speech, primarily known for being hate speech" are your OR claims. It's not like anyone is preventing you from adding this claim to the lead - with reliable sources. You haven't done that. You can hardly expect we will add this claim to the article, referencing User:Icewhiz on Wikipedia... The lead does, of course, represent what the sources say, i.e. " The "Paradise for Jews" part of the proverb, which refers to the Golden Age of Jews in Poland,[5][6] has been criticized as exaggerating the position of Jews in the Commonwealth society, which was not that comparable to the most privileged class, the nobility." Not you, nor anyone else has disputed this characterization on article's talk. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 08:53, 12 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Comment. If this phrase or any part of it was highly antisemitic, it wouldn't be used by POLIN Museum as the name of its exhibition for the Golden Age of Jews in Poland ([11]): In the Paradisus Iudaeorum gallery, visitors [...] will explore a large map of Jewish settlement in the Commonwealth, and will find out what religious tolerance meant in the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries, and why Poland came to be known as “Paradisus Iudaeorum” – a Jewish paradise Let's have some common sense here. Scholars agree it is an exaggeration, but exaggeration is not anti-semitism. A single scholar has made such a claim, dozens of others do not agree with such an association and the phrase continues to be generally used in the positive (Golden Age) context. A WP:FRINGE statement by a single scholar should not be taken with undue weight; other scholars noted before and after that is is an exaggeration, but that's making mountains out of molehills, and per sources cited in the article, usage of this phrase to refer to Golden Age is much more common that any discussion of antisemitism (again: only one scholar has called this phrase antisemitic, dozens of others have used it in a positive Golden Age context, and again, the POLIN Museum doesn't even think this issue needs any clarification on their webpage). And to further stress the fringiness of this view, see [12] which includes a review of her article (which got reprinted in a book), and the reviewer, Piotr Wróbel, says the following: "Janicka is not shy about presenting risky historical interpretations and claims". See the referenced discussion in the article for more details. Longer version is: Janicka, a minor if reliable scholar, has been very critical of the museum exhibition, and thinks it minimizes the issue of antisemitism. Other scholars have disagreed with her or taken a more neutral stance, and nobody repeated her assertion that this exhibit title/phrase is particularly problematic (i.e. antisemitic). As noted in [13]: "a heated debate surrounded the name of the gallery". One scholar called the name antisemitic, but one scholar's fringe opinion should not be given undue weight, even if one Wikipedian seems to be fixated on it. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 09:49, 12 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol voting keep.svg It meets the requirements for DYK, article is neutral, and so is the hook. Support ALT2 for the hook as it's most hook-y. The objections appear to be spurious and may be motivated by personal issues between Icewhiz and other editors. Volunteer Marek 22:57, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
Symbol possible vote.svg I have reverted the promotion to a preparation area as per discussions at Wikipedia talk:Did you know. Flibirigit (talk) 05:40, 25 November 2018 (UTC)
Comment This saying does not belong bolded on Wikipedia's front page. And for God's sake it's almost Chanukah. That would be pretty, eh? valereee (talk) 12:54, 25 November 2018 (UTC)
Why not? It's a Polish Jewish history topic about a saying that despite claims to the contrary is NOT controversial (find me a single newspaper piece that says it is... instead of the dozen+ presented that use it without a second thought to refer to the Golden Age of Jews in Poland). In fact, it would be a very good Chanukah DYK, since it is a good time to display hooks related to Jewish topics. And it would be good if people would stop with the WP:INDONTLIKEIT. Again, no media source has ever been critical of this saying, instead it is used to remind people of the Golden Age of the Jewish history. If anything is antisemitic here, it's not the saying, it is an attempt to censor the Jewish history topics of the front page. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 04:31, 26 November 2018 (UTC)
From the article: 'The author of the 1606 pasquinade is unknown, through it has been suggested by Stanisław Kot that it was created by a Catholic townsman, perhaps a priest, jealous of the nobility and the Jewry. Konrad Matyjaszek has described the 1606 work as "expressing anti-gentry and anti-Jewish sentiments"' It has nothing to do with me liking it or not. I'm happy to have Jewish history on the front page, and the topic certainly deserves an article. I'll take it on good faith that the article has been sourced from neutral historians with a variety of viewpoints, and that their analysis has been represented fairly by its editors. My concern is that it this proverb has antisemitic roots, and that makes it as inappropriate for the front page as any other derogatory phrase for a group of people valereee (talk) 12:56, 26 November 2018 (UTC)

Wilhelm Kempf (bishop)

Relief bust of Wilhelm Kempf
Relief bust of Wilhelm Kempf

Created by Gerda Arendt (talk). Self-nominated at 08:03, 2 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol confirmed.svg Good article that reads well. I've only made a couple of minor style tweaks. Checklist: hook validated directly from www.limburg.de source, ☑Y, length ☑Y, timescale ☑Y, sufficiently referenced, albeit some taken in good faith ☑Y, structure and style ☑Y. As far as I'm concerned this is good to go. Bermicourt (talk) 20:09, 16 October 2018 (UTC)
Symbol question.svg Hello, I came to promote this, but perhaps the hook could be rewritten to make it snappier? It doesn't seem that clear right now, particularly the part that says "introduced the changes of the Second Vatican Council in which he took part". Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 10:39, 22 October 2018 (UTC)
Not sure what you mean, - could you make a suggestion? My try (and sorry that I am not gifted with snappyness):
ALT1: ... that Wilhelm Kempf (pictured), Bishop of Limburg from 1949 to 1981, took part in the Second Vatican Council, and introduced its changes in his diocese?
The council changed the church's view on/of itself dramatically, but tough to say that in few words. Or could you? Or someone watching? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 10:53, 22 October 2018 (UTC)
The hook seems to imply that it was Kempf who proposed the changes done in Vatican II (as in during the council itself), which is contrary to what the article says (which merely says that he introduced the Vatican II changes in Limburg). As for ALT1, I don't think it works since Vatican II was implemented throughout the Catholic world and thus being the one to introduce it in a diocese is not uncommon (disclosure: I'm Catholic so I'm actually familiar with Vatican II and the changes implemented because of it). Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 11:11, 22 October 2018 (UTC)
ALT2: ... that Wilhelm Kempf (pictured), Bishop of Limburg from 1949 to 1981, took part in the Second Vatican Council?
No room to say that he enthusiastically introduced the changes, and was criticised for it, while others may have done only what they had to. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:40, 22 October 2018 (UTC)
@Bermicourt: Thoughts on ALT1 and ALT2? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 20:53, 22 October 2018 (UTC)
I like the source which says: "Bishop Wilhelm Kempf carried the ethos [from the end] of the Second Vatican Council, of which he was one of five sub-secretaries, to his Diocese, which - although small in area and numbers - soon set an outstanding example [in terms of the reforms]." I wonder if part of that could be woven into a hook? Just trying to help. Bermicourt (talk) 18:37, 23 October 2018 (UTC)
Gerda Arendt, Narutolovehinata5, this has been sitting for over a month. Where does this stand now, and whose response is needed at this point? Many thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 15:51, 24 November 2018 (UTC)
I was happy with the original hook, but Narutolovehinata5 wasn't and so Gerda and he or she suggested some alternatives. I wasn't convinced so I cited a source directly which I felt could be used and left the ball in Narutolovehinata5's court. To move this along, here's another suggested hook based on that source: Bermicourt (talk) 18:29, 24 November 2018 (UTC)
ALT3: ... that Wilhelm Kempf (pictured), Bishop of Limburg from 1949 to 1981, set an outstanding example in introducing the reforms of Vatican II to his Diocese?
I struck the original, as it was explained that it's not clear whether he took part in the Council or the changes. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 19:05, 24 November 2018 (UTC)
@Bermicourt: I kind of like ALT3 but the hook fact isn't explicitly mentioned in the source. @Gerda Arendt: , the "The church historian Friedrich Kempf [de] was his younger brother" statement lacks a footnote. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 23:50, 24 November 2018 (UTC)
Oh dear, wir drehen uns im Kreis... @Narutolovehinata5: I've reworded the lede in line with the hook which is explicitly mentioned in the first reference of the article which states: "Bischof Wilhelm Kempf trug die Aufbruchstimmung des Zweiten Vatikanischen Konzils, zu dessen fünf Subsekretären er zählte, ins Bistum, das - obwohl klein an Fläche und Katholikenzahl - schon bald eine herausragende Stellung gewann." The article is this one. Bermicourt (talk) 08:51, 25 November 2018 (UTC)
@Bermicourt and Gerda Arendt: Again, the hook fact is not in the article. Either the article needs to be reworded, or a new hook needs to be proposed here. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:15, 26 November 2018 (UTC)
I'd like to write in the article what is in a German source "er trug die Aufbruchstimmung des Konzils in seine Diöcese", but there's no good word for "Aufbruchstimmung", I asked translators and they come up with "enthusiasm", "departure", "awakening". None of them conveys "Stimmung" (= mood, atmosphere). "Aufbruch" - departure - literally means "break up". Help? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:52, 26 November 2018 (UTC)
I am really sad that there's no English term for Aufbruchsstimmung. The best I find is "atmosphere for new beginnings", as if there were old beginnings. It's when crusts need to be broken to begin something new, - something like disruption ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:47, 4 December 2018 (UTC)
ALT4: that Wilhelm Kempf (pictured), Bishop of Limburg from 1949 to 1981, brought the sense of expectation from Vatican II into his Diocese, which soon became a leading light for the reforms? Bermicourt (talk) 18:33, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
Thank you, but "leading light" is not in the article. Can we instead word that he took part in the Council? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:45, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
It's a translation of "herausragende Stellung". But only a suggestion. And I thought you wanted to include Aufbruchstimmung? Bermicourt (talk) 21:33, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
I'd think "outstanding" was better for "herausragend". Feel free to add it to the article, - I have a few other topics where I am behind. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:44, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
It's more literal, but I was trying to be more poetic. :) I'm running out of time as we're off to Germany shortly, but I'll try and look at it tonight. Bermicourt (talk) 07:44, 6 December 2018 (UTC)
First time I hear of "poetic" on DYK, - love it! Only, I'm afraid we are supposed to stay factual.
ALT5: ... that Wilhelm Kempf (pictured), Bishop of Limburg from 1949 to 1981, took part in the Second Vatican Council and introduced its changes in his diocese in an outstanding way? ... in an exemplary way? ... with enthusiasm?
... instead of "changes" perhaps "new concepts"? "drastic changes"? or what? - Have a god trip, Bermicourt? I'd have Christmas music recommendations for Idstein (8, 9, 24) and Wiesbaden (16, 25), if you are in that area. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:46, 6 December 2018 (UTC)
Let me have a think about that. Well our family trip is not quite that cultured. I'm going to see my boyhood favourite football team, Borussia MG, play Stuttgart. And we're all going to the Christmas market in Düss. The cultural bit is more local: the BSO's New Year Concert. Bermicourt (talk) 19:43, 6 December 2018 (UTC)
Actually I still like the vitality of ALT4 and think it faithfully reflects the spirit of Aufbruchstimmung and herausragende Stellung. Maybe we should utilise "groundbreaking" since that echoes Aufbruch both literally and figuratively. How about this modification:
ALT6: that Wilhelm Kempf (pictured), Bishop of Limburg from 1949 to 1981, brought the sense of expectation of groundbreaking change from Vatican II into his Diocese, which soon became a leading light of the reforms? Bermicourt (talk) 19:57, 6 December 2018 (UTC)
Good ideas, but now we have four words (sense expectation groundbraking change) before we get to the Council, - a word (Council) I'd not want to miss. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:05, 6 December 2018 (UTC)
I think we've ended up with a bit of role-reversal here lol. You're supposed to suggest the hooks and I'm supposed to comment and, hopefully, approve them! I'm sorry, I was trying to be helpful, but maybe I'm just muddying the waters. So I'll stop now and let you make the running! (but don't worry, I'm on your side, honest). GB. Bermicourt (talk) 21:06, 6 December 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 2

The Nature of Prejudice

Created by Piotrus (talk). Self-nominated at 11:25, 2 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg -- there is work to do here. For starters, it would be nice to have sections. And the book cover. Second, it needs a copy edit; I made a few obvious ones, but I note that the third paragraph starts with a grammatical error. In the second note the book title needs to be italicized; etc. Oh, the claim in the last sentence needs to be ascribed to someone; we can't be saying it I suppose a summary of the book isn't mandatory, but it would be nice--it's what we expect from a book article. Now, the hook is verified, the article is new enough and long enough and I smell no plagiarism, but it needs serious cleanup. Drmies (talk) 21:56, 14 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Why I don't disagree with you, the issues you are raising are IMHO irrelevant to the DYK (now, if this was a WP:GAN, you'd be dead right). Quality issues like this are not part of the DYK requirements. I am of course happy if people would like to expand things, but I don't believe it is necessary. Btw, I don't see the grammar error. Also, I don't see the need for attribution (the sentence is cited, after all). Lastly, academic books don't have plot summary sections, the content of the book is already summarized. I guess we could add a chapter list? PS. I did add an infobox (through again, it is not required for a DYK; it's not like I am self-assessing this article any higher than start, maybe C-class...). --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 07:35, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Piotrus, we've danced this dance before. I'm happy you wrote this up, it's important, but if we're putting it on the front page it should be representative of our quality. The grammar error is in "Describing the book significance"--needs to have a genitive for "book". I didn't say "plot summary", I said summary, and the only thing the article says about the book is the one sentence about some scale. The rest is all caught up inside reviewers' remarks. Having a summary is a Good Thing. I don't care about the infobox, BTW, though lots of people do. And the attribution, that is necessary. That it's cited is beside the point: what matters is that an opinion is cited ("One of the reasons for its success"), and it may be a very reasonable and well-argued opinion, but it's not a fact. Thus, attribution. Thanks, Drmies (talk) 14:16, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Drmies Yes, we danced this indeed, and as I am sure I said it before, your standards are too high for DYK. If you see a grammar error, please fix it. I am not a native speaker and occasionally I don't see them. I stand by what I said - all your other requests, while all beneficial to the article (except the attribution, which I say is not needed through harmless) are not required for this to be on the front page. If you have a problem with that, try changing DYK requirements/guidelines. Ping User:BlueMoonset for 3O. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 05:34, 17 October 2018 (UTC)
    Well, I am not a native speaker either, and I'm not your copyeditor. Yngvadottir, thank you so much for looking over the article, and for the attribution--which of course is necessary, given NPOV. Good day Piotrus. Drmies (talk) 13:50, 17 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol redirect vote 4.svg Full review needed; check should include whether the article still needs a copy edit. BlueMoonset (talk) 02:30, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
I looked, and don't think we can have a book article not saying (besides the lead which should be a summary) who wrote it when and why and about what. All reviews are interesting only in relation to that. - Formally, under a section header, a person's name should be repeated, so probably also a book's. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:30, 7 December 2018 (UTC)

2018 National League Central tie-breaker game, 2018 National League West tie-breaker game

Created by Muboshgu (talk), Spanneraol (talk), Mdumas43073 (talk), and Eposty (talk). Nominated by Muboshgu (talk) at 03:17, 2 October 2018 (UTC).

  • The above noms have redundant highlighted links and WP:EASTEREGGs. I think we should use informative links for the readers as suggested below. Any comments?-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:51, 5 October 2018 (UTC)
  • The editing seems to be winding down and limited to the aftermath at this point. However, we now know the aftermath will not conclude until the season is over. I am actually quite shocked that the article is being presented without any mention that the Rockies were going for their first ever NL West title, which is as important as the Dodgers being 5x defending champs.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:14, 10 October 2018 (UTC)
  • I realize that there is a whole featured topic of these to be modeled after, but I think each article should say Team A was going for their Xth National League Division title and Yth National League Foo Division title (if the team has moved divisions like the Cubs) for each team.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:31, 10 October 2018 (UTC)
  • The above are suggestions. However, here is the review:
Both articles are long enough and new enough.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:34, 10 October 2018 (UTC)
I prefer the ALT2 that I have nominated to the other noms and consider this an interesting, well-formed hook.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:38, 10 October 2018 (UTC)
Content is within policy.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:38, 10 October 2018 (UTC)
There are still no QPQ reviews presented.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:41, 10 October 2018 (UTC)
Although I am not sure why, there are no images. It would seem to me that some biographical photos could be included, but I realize there are probably no photos from the game to include.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:43, 10 October 2018 (UTC)
Can we get a citation for "This game was also in fact the first National League divisional tiebreaker ever to not involve the Dodgers."-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 22:50, 11 October 2018 (UTC)
I don't know who added that sentence, and can't find a source saying that, so I deleted it. I'll do qpq shortly. – Muboshgu (talk) 00:47, 12 October 2018 (UTC)
Isn't there a page somewhere on the internet that lists all NL tie-breaker results historically?-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 12:08, 13 October 2018 (UTC)
The best appears to be this. – Muboshgu (talk) 02:02, 14 October 2018 (UTC)
Which points out to me that the statement I removed was false, because the Dodgers were not involved in 1998 National League Wild Card tie-breaker game. – Muboshgu (talk) 02:03, 14 October 2018 (UTC)
I thought divisional tie-breakers and Wild Card tie-breakers were different things. Why would a Wild Card tie-breaker invalidate the prior statement?-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:34, 14 October 2018 (UTC)
@TonyTheTiger: I had forgotten about this nom. You're right, it doesn't invalidate it, because of the "divisional" qualifier. But that's too trivial anyway. A tiebreaker is a tiebreaker. – Muboshgu (talk) 22:03, 11 November 2018 (UTC)
@Muboshgu: we are not really tasked with determining what is trivial. We summarize the secondary sources. If they are mentioning it, we should mention it. I consider it significant (but I am a lifelong Dodger fan).-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 14:50, 13 November 2018 (UTC)
@TonyTheTiger: Agreed, but it was a Wikipedia editor who added it and I couldn't find it in secondary sources, which is the reason I removed it. – Muboshgu (talk) 14:57, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 3

Lapa do Santo

View from the rockshelter entrance
View from the rockshelter entrance
  • ALT1 that Lapa do Santo, in Minas Gerais, Brazil, has evidence of human occupation around 12,000 years ago, as well as the oldest recorded case of decapitation in the Americas? Source: [15] [16]
Reviewed The Sensorites

Created by Strauss MAE-USP (talk). Nominated by Mike Peel (talk) at 21:51, 3 October 2018 (UTC).

Policy compliance:

QPQ: Done.

Overall: Symbol question.svg epicgenius (talk) 01:15, 4 October 2018 (UTC)

@Epicgenius: Thanks for the review. Can you have another look? I've proposed a longer hook, ALT1, above. @Strauss MAE-USP: has added references. The similar phrases look minimal to me, are there particular ones you think need rewriting? Thanks. Mike Peel (talk) 22:58, 5 October 2018 (UTC)
@Strauss MAE-USP and Mike Peel: ALT1 looks much better. I definitely might be interested by the first recorded decapitation in the Americas. So you have my thumbs up for that one. I really only have three concerns with copyvios, and here they are:
  • "the reduction of the body by means of mutilation, defleshing, tooth removal, exposure to fire and possibly cannibalism, followed by the secondary burial of the remains according to strict rules" - possibly unattributed direct quote
  • "the oldest case of decapitation in the New World" and "were filled with disarticulated bones of a single" - these phrases are too close to the quoted text, even a paraphrase would be good.
  • "three distinct periods of human occupation" - same as above from this source.
That's all of the phrases I was concerned about. Now for the sourcing:
  • "The rockshelter and the archaeological site" doesn't have any sources. A general rule of thumb is to aim for at least one source per paragraph.
  • "Mobility" still doesn't have any sources.
  • The ends of many paragraphs don't have sources. In some cases only the first sentence has a source. On the other hand, all of the references look reliable and authoritative. My issue is with the placement of the sources. Could you move them to the end of the paragraph?
That's all of the outstanding DYK issues. Now going off on a few personal style nitpicks:
  • Although not necessary, I'd also suggest cleaning up this article to comply with some MOS guidelines. For instance, putting the periods before the references.
  • I'm concerned that there are way too many images in this article (there are 231 in total, but only about 4 thumbnail images, the rest are in galleries). WP:NOTGALLERY. Have you considered creating a gallery on Commons?
Sorry to bother you with all these issues. I know it sounds like a lot, but from the looks of it, this article probably does not need that many modifications to get it into good shape for DYK. On a personal note, I am impressed by Strauss MAE-USP's work on this article with over 25 kB of prose size. Maybe this can be nominated as a good article later. epicgenius (talk) 17:59, 6 October 2018 (UTC)
@Epicgenius: sorry for the delay in following this up. I've sorted out the copyvio issues, and quickly checked through the style formatting. I don't think that a gallery on commons would be useful (they fell out of style on Commons quite a while back now), although I'd agree that there are too many pictures here right now. I started this nom after seeing @Strauss MAE-USP's work here, I don't know the subject myself, so I can't help with improving the referencing so much. Maybe @Joalpe: can help there? Thanks. Mike Peel (talk) 06:51, 22 October 2018 (UTC)
@Mike Peel: It's OK. I'm still monitoring this nomination. So far it doesn't look like there has been much activity on the page since I last commented. I'll give it a few more weeks before I ask someone else to look at this. epicgenius (talk) 14:02, 24 October 2018 (UTC)
@Mike Peel, Strauss MAE-USP, and Joalpe: Has there been any progress on this article? I know that the comments above might seem like a lot, but there are really only three or four outstanding issues. Otherwise I'm going to ask for another reviewer's opinion. epicgenius (talk) 01:43, 16 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 8

Einsatzgruppe H, Hlinka Guard Emergency Divisions, Kremnička and Nemecká massacres

* ... that Einsatzkommando 14 and local collaborators committed the two most notorious massacres in the history of Slovakia? Source: "You are strongly encouraged to quote the source text supporting each hook" (and [link] the source, or cite it briefly without using citation templates)

    • ALT1:... that Einsatzkommando 14 and local collaborators committed the two largest massacres in the history of Slovakia?
    • In case three articles in one hook is too many, we could also go with:
      • ALT2a: ... that "Slovaks killed Slovaks" during the two largest massacres in the history of Slovakia? Source: Title of this article, Schön, Jozef (16 March 2017). "Keď Slovák vraždil Slováka". Hnonline (in Slovak). "When Slovaks killed Slovaks"
      • ALT2b: ... that along with murdering or deporting thousands of Jews and Romani people, Einsatzgruppe H targeted German soldiers suspected of defeatism and homosexuality?

Created by Catrìona (talk). Self-nominated at 08:39, 8 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Comment I'm fairly sure for three bolded links you need 3 reviews, or am I wrong? Juxlos (talk) 13:49, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Comment Where are the source texts for hooks requested in the nomination form?Georgejdorner (talk) 18:36, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
@Juxlos: You're correct, that's in the supplementary rules and I wasn't aware of it. plus Added. @Georgejdorner: It is not actually a requirement to quote sources, as long as they are cited in the article (which these are, see then end of Kremnička and Nemecká massacres). The reason why I commented on your hook is that it was odd to include a quote that did not actually support the proposed hook. There is actually no source describing the massacres as "notorious" simply because almost all sources are non-English, but being described as the "Slovak Katyn" and similar means that it's reasonable to conclude that this is the general view on the massacres in Slovakia. Catrìona (talk) 01:55, 9 October 2018 (UTC)
Thank you for the comment on my nom. It aided me in writing an improved hook.
I made the comments above about sourcing so you might correct the problems before you are reviewed. As your own nomination form states above (where you failed to give a source), "Source: "You are strongly encouraged to quote the source text supporting each hook" (and [link] the source, or cite it briefly without using citation templates)" Hooks ALT1 and ALT2b have no sourcing whatsoever. A lenient reviewer might let you slide on ALT2a.
And, yes, I recall when mentioning your cite without a link or quote was acceptable here in DYK, but times have changed.
Best regards.Georgejdorner (talk) 02:00, 13 October 2018 (UTC)
@Georgejdorner: I don't understand your emphasis on putting the sources in the hook nomination. The most important thing is that the hook facts are cited in the article, per WP:DYK#Eligibility criteria 3. Cited hook. Yoninah (talk) 13:46, 31 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Comment: I haven't seen a link to somewhere in the middle of a bolded article, and think it's not a good idea, - found it confusing. - And yes, 3 qpq reviews please. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 10:48, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
@Gerda Arendt: Thanks for your comment. There are 3 qpqs listed above. How about:
      • ALT3a: ... that Slovak collaborators participated in the two largest massacres in Slovakia during World War II? Rajcan, Vanda; Vadkerty, Madeline; Hlavinka, Ján (2018). "Slovakia". In Megargee, Geoffrey P.; White, Joseph R.; Hecker, Mel. Camps and Ghettos under European Regimes Aligned with Nazi Germany. Encyclopedia of Camps and Ghettos. 3. United States Holocaust Memorial Museum. ISBN 978-0-253-02373-5. p. 849
      • ALT3b: ... that along with murdering or deporting thousands of Jews and Romani people, Einsatzgruppe H targeted German soldiers suspected of defeatism and homosexuality? Šindelářová, Lenka (2013). "Einsatzgruppe H na povstaleckém Slovensku". Soudobé dějiny (in Czech). Prague. XX (4): 582–603. ISSN 1210-7050. p. 588 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Catrìona (talkcontribs) 08:48, 21 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol redirect vote 4.svg Full review needed now that new ALT hooks have been provided. BlueMoonset (talk) 15:43, 29 October 2018 (UTC)
  • It appears that this is a November 5 date request and it is November 2. No one seems to want to take on this review, so I might as well.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:50, 2 November 2018 (UTC)
  • First, let's get these nominations into one hook. Based on the WP:LEAD of Hlinka Guard Emergency Divisions you could go with the following, although I have to take a look at the sources and make sure it is backed up:
  • ALT4... that the Hlinka Guard Emergency Divisions were known for there crimes against humanity in the Kremnička and Nemecká massacres in conjuction with Einsatzgruppe H?--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 05:07, 2 November 2018 (UTC)
@TonyTheTiger: Thanks for taking on this review. Your proposed hook is factually correct, except as far as I know "crimes against humanity" as a legal matter was not used to charge any of the perpetrators. It would be more accurate to say that Einsatzgruppe H sponsored the massacre, and the Hlinka Guard Emergency Divisions was drafted into helping them. However, after writing this I decided that trying to shoehorn the three articles into one hook wasn't as effective as separating them into two hooks; see above. The special occasion date (for the hook mentioning the Kremnicka/Nemecka massacres) doesn't have to be 5 November; it would be equally appropriate to have it on 20 November, 12 or 19 December, 4, 5, 11, or 20 January, or 19 February (the massacres took place on multiple days). Catrìona (talk) 05:19, 2 November 2018 (UTC)
  1. @TonyTheTiger: I don't think that ALT4 is a good hook. So what if the two units were involved in a massacre? It doesn't give the reader any reason to click any of the links. Whereas, that Slovak collaborators were involved in the largest massacres on Slovak soil, that is noteworthy and interesting, and so is the fact that Einsatzgruppe H also targeted their own men.
  2. They're separate articles on the Czech and Slovak wikis, but I thought it made more sense to keep them in the same article since most sources discuss them together. The massacres involved the same perpetrators and victims, took place at the same location and with the same motivation. The victims had even been arrested in the same way and were taken from the same prison. According to one source, the perpetrators decided to switch the site of killings from Kremnicka to Nemecka because they ran out of space in the anti-tank ditches. (The Katyn massacre also took place in multiple locations.) Catrìona (talk) 05:44, 2 November 2018 (UTC)
  • TonyTheTiger, I don't see that you've yet given this review an icon. Even if there is still more to do, in a review this long, it's important to let the nominator and others to know its current status. Thank you. BlueMoonset (talk) 03:56, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol question.svg This set of articles is pretty close. However, I am a bit troubled by the merger of two articles here that seem to be separate articles in other wikis that are culturally closer to the subject. I sort of view the Czech and Slovak wikis as the place where the subject matter experts are. If they view these as separate topics, why should we have a merged article. I am open to outside opinions on this matter, but encourage considering splitting the articles. I also mentioned an issue with alternate wikis in the text following a redlink. We can revisit the hooks, when we resolve the article merge/split issue.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:15, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
@TonyTheTiger: Personally, I think it's odd that you would consider the Czech and Slovak wikis as definitive, given that the articles you are talking about (both Czech and Slovak) have no citations at all. Also, you haven't advanced a proposal or much of any argument why separating the articles would be beneficial. Currently, the article is independently rated B-class but it would probably be stub- or start-class if split. As for interlanguage links, a specific template exists for this purpose, and is widely used all over Wikipedia. If you don't like it, you should nominate the template for deletion. Catrìona (talk) 06:15, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
Honestly, I don't know what interlanguage link templates are suppose to be used for. I have met with great resistance in my editorial experience. I have also never chanced upon one in article space, to my recollection. That being said, my calling in to question whether they meet core policies and guidelines is one of the few things I am suppose to check according to the review criteria here at DYK and has nothing to do with whether an article should be at WP:AFD, which is a notability judgement. Without digging through policy, I thought we might jointly determine that it was something that needed to be rectified. I may have to dig through interwiki link policy. In regard to the split/merge, I don't judge foreign wikis for verifiability. En Wiki did not start enforcing verifiability until it got well past 1 million articles.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 16:26, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol redirect vote 4.svg Second opinion requested as to whether it is relevant for DYK that one of the nominated articles here (on two massacres) is done as separate massacre articles on another language wiki, since that has been stalling this nomination for over three weeks. Thank you. BlueMoonset (talk) 02:59, 29 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 9

Super League XXIV

  • ... that the London Broncos will play in rugby league's Super League XXIV in a rugby union stadium smaller than RFL standards? Source: Sky Sports

Created by L1amw90 (talk) and The C of E (talk). Nominated by The C of E (talk) at 07:17, 11 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg @The C of E: I don't see how this hook is interesting to a broad audience. It's not that uncommon for sports teams to play games in smaller-than-normal stadiums (like DC United's occasional home games in Maryland, Seattle Sounders FC sometimes playing in its training ground, or the Los Angeles Chargers playing at a soccer-specific stadium). In addition, I feel that the hook is not interesting to non-rugby fans, and as far as I am aware, it's not uncommon for stadiums to host both union and league, and in any case the hook feels rambling. How about something simply something like "the London Broncos will play their rugby league game at a rugby union stadium?" or something to that effect? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 12:09, 14 October 2018 (UTC)
  • @Narutolovehinata5: No, I think that this hook has sufficient interest and I don't see any reason to change it. I think the general public might find it interesting in that there will be a club that has allowed to play their matches in a stadium smaller than the league's regulations. indeed your proposed alt is basically the same as my original just without the mention of that fact so I am happy to stick with the one I have proposed. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 15:15, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
I'm afraid your proposed hook is not interesting to a broad audience. Like audiences wouldn't really care about stadium sizes and the like; I'm pretty sure we've discussed something similar to this before. And in many parts of the world, smaller stadiums are the norm, not the exception. Perhaps if the RFL was a well-known league worldwide like the NFL, the Premiere League, or the IPL, but the RFL is much more niche. As such, I've gone ahead and struck the hook. Also, I'd also like to ask the opinions of fellow sports article contributor Hawkeye7 on their thoughts on both the article and the hook. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 01:04, 16 October 2018 (UTC)
I disagree, I think the hook is fine as it is and as I mentioned above your proposal is exactly the same as the original (less the reference to size) so what is the difference. I'm not prepared to change it at this so have unstruck it for another reviewer. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 05:32, 16 October 2018 (UTC)
Once a hook has been struck, it can't normally be unstruck by the nominator, only by a reviewer; I have re-struck the hook, please do not unstrike unless me, Hawkeye7, or another editor says so. I'd wait for a second opinion here on whether or not it's appropriate, but for now, a new hook is needed. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 06:16, 16 October 2018 (UTC)
I think you'll find that under WP:DYKRULES, there is no such rule that says that. As such, I am unstriking and prepared to wait for a new reviewer. It is certainly appropriate as it is accurate and sourced inline in the article. Subjective opinions on if it is interesting are irrelevant. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 15:12, 16 October 2018 (UTC)
You may wish to read the comment left by BlueMoonset on Template:Did you know nominations/Sun of Unclouded Righteousness, specifically the quote he certainly should not be unstriking any hook struck by a reviewer. With that said, I will request a second review over a WT:DYK on hook interest and will leave the hook unstruck for now while waiting for other opinions. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 15:38, 16 October 2018 (UTC)
Boring hook. The Rambling Man (talk) 18:32, 16 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol possible vote.svg Adding an icon reflective of a nomination without an unstruck hook. If The C of E doesn't wish to provide a new hook, then they can always withdraw the nomination. No one gets to insist on keeping their hook in the face of reviewer agreement that there are problems with it. BlueMoonset (talk) 01:25, 17 October 2018 (UTC)
  • The issue here is that it is going to be very difficult to find an interesting hook when there is so little information in the article other than the utterly routine stuff such as the format of the league and the teams in it - hardly surprising as the season hasn’t even started yet. Pawnkingthree (talk) 01:31, 17 October 2018 (UTC)
@BlueMoonset and Pawnkingthree: Per discussions on Discord and reading through the article again, would this work?
ALT1 ... that rugby league's Super League XXIV will feature a top five play-offs system?" Apparently such systems aren't actually unusual in rugby (given that the format has an article), but as a non-rugby fan, I kind of found that fact interesting since most playoff formats involve an even number of teams. Thoughts? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 01:42, 17 October 2018 (UTC)
Let's go with ALT1. Top five playoffs are fairly common in Australia, but unusual elsewhere. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 02:01, 17 October 2018 (UTC)
Narutolovehinata5, Hawkeye7, source 3 appears to be talking about the top five playoffs system being reintroduced for promotion of one Championship League team to the Super League at the end of a season (taking the place of the Super League team with the worst record, which is relegated to the Championship League). So ALT1 is not properly sourced. The Championship League had an eight-team playoff through 2018; Super League abandoned their eight-team playoff in 2015 for a four-team playoff system if one is to believe the Super League play-offs article. That same article notes that the top five system was used from 1998 through 2001, and that fact, if it can be supported (no sourcing in the article), might make a good hook:
Reading between the lines of the Super League play-offs article, 1998 was the year of Super League III, the first year there were playoffs in Super League, and it was the top-five version that's being used anew in 2019. Again, if sourcing can be found (the only source used for Super League III is behind a paywall, and I can't check it), an even more interesting hook would be possible:
Would someone know where to find the necessary sourcing and be able to make the necessary additions to the article for these hooks to be supported, assuming they're deemed interesting enough? BlueMoonset (talk) 02:41, 17 October 2018 (UTC)
So the playing in another club's ground with permission is more boring than the playoff format? I'd have thought that would have had even less of a "broad" reach plus I find them boring therefore I do not accept these proposals so I am striking them. I am prepared to amend my hook by adding a geographical indicator to make it more "interesting":
ALT4 ... that the London Broncos will play in rugby league's predominately Northern England based Super League XXIV in a rugby union stadium smaller than RFL standards? The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 12:48, 17 October 2018 (UTC)
  • That does not make the hook any more interesting in my opinion. The ALT2 and ALT3 are marginally better. Pawnkingthree (talk) 12:59, 17 October 2018 (UTC)
The C of E, I am very aware that you really want to stick with your proposal on stadium size, but multiple reviewers here have already stated that it is not a good option. ALT4 is just as bland as the original and arguably even more inaccessible, because let's face it, the average reader is unlikely to be one that cares about RFL standards or Northern England. I am unstriking ALT2 and ALT3 and have struck ALT4 as not addressing reviewer concerns; please do not revert unless told to by a reviewer, as this is considered going against reviewer consensus. Symbol redirect vote 4.svg I will also make a request at WT:DYK for an uninvolved editor to make the full review here. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 15:35, 17 October 2018 (UTC)
ALT5 ... that London Broncos defeated Toronto Wolfpack to earn promotion to the mostly Northern England based Super League XXIV? The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 15:51, 17 October 2018 (UTC)
I'm afraid that's not really a good hook either, although it's probably a better option than ALT0 and ALT4. The problem is that promotion and relegation isn't unusual at all and most readers would be unfamiliar with either team. With that said, the opinions of previous reviewers @Pawnkingthree, BlueMoonset, Hawkeye7, and The Rambling Man: would still be appreciated here, since this is a new proposal. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 15:55, 17 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Fail. There's nothing interesting in a league that's yet to start, no matter how contrived anyone tries to make it. Send in Vanamonde93 to find something here given he's solely in charge of what is and what is not interesting, despite allowing dozens of hooks go through to the main page, including those which are on the main page today, apart from just one that I was involved with. The Rambling Man (talk) 21:51, 21 October 2018 (UTC)
    This is getting rather tiresome: there was absolutely no cause to ping me here. I have pulled hooks for reasons of interest on several occasions. I do so typically when I promote a prep to queue, or promote a special occasion hook, which is what brought me to your hook. If you think I'm giving you special attention, I'm flattered, but I don't have that sort of time. FTR, the original hook is not interesting to a broad audience. Vanamonde (talk) 21:56, 21 October 2018 (UTC)
    Yet this so-called admin who has seen "more football than most" deems other hooks instantly boring? Wow. This may be tiresome, but this is the lot you have chosen. Fail this, and I will continually question Vanamonde93 as to why every boring hook that gets through hasn't been pulled. That's reasonable given the short shrift the hook I proposed was given, yet pulled and then replaced with a bunch of shit, without any kind of apology. Even now. So, that's your lot Vanamonde, deal with it. The Rambling Man (talk) 22:01, 21 October 2018 (UTC)
    That makes no sense. I will pull hooks only when I review them at some stage of the process. If you think I ought to check every hook posted to the main page, please think again. Vanamonde (talk) 22:06, 21 October 2018 (UTC)
    No, of course, you only check the hooks you read. Revelation. So this hook falls squarely, more squarely, into Vanamonde's "not interesting" loop, and certainly mine too. Fail this nomination, move on. Looking forward to the next revelation from this admin. The Rambling Man (talk) 22:18, 21 October 2018 (UTC)
    So you didn't have a good reason to ping me, because I was uninvolved, and you were not asking for my input. Please don't ping me under those circumstances again. Vanamonde (talk) 22:22, 21 October 2018 (UTC)
    Please don't act unilaterally against consensus and introduce errors at the last moment. Please approach DYK consistently. Please try harder. The Rambling Man (talk) 08:44, 22 October 2018 (UTC)
  • I agree with TRM that there is fundamentally nothing interesting that can be said about a league that has yet to start. I don't find the fact that there's one London based team and the rest are northern interesting enough for a broad audience. Not every new article is suitable for DYK and I think this should be failed.Pawnkingthree (talk) 13:05, 22 October 2018 (UTC)
@Pawnkingthree: I disagree. Just because something is new doesn't mean that it can't be suitable for DYK. Yes the league has yet to begin, that doesn't mean something can't be said about it. For example, I actually like the part about that Top 5 playoffs; as mentioned above, it appears to be common in Australia but not elsewhere, and as a sports fan I found it unusual that their playoffs system had an odd number of teams. With that said, I'd like to hear your thoughts on ALT2 and ALT3; if you don't like them, I'd like to hear The C of E's thoughts one more time, and if we can't get into an agreement, I'm willing to fail this. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 21:03, 22 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Sigh* I see I have little choice, I for the life of me cannot see how a hook about a playoff format is more interesting than the fact we had a London team fighting it out with a Canadian team for a place in a mostly Northern competition. I'd still prefer one of my hooks but I regrettably won't object if they use one of the others. It's this sort of thing that made me take a brief hiatus from DYK because I used to enjoy doing it; it relaxed me not stressed me out as it does with this sort of thing. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 18:47, 23 October 2018 (UTC)
@Narutolovehinata5: I'm not thrilled about a format-based hook but If you like the playoff suggestions and C of E won't object, it does seem to be the best we have. I would say that ALT 3 is the marginally better one. Pawnkingthree (talk) 19:18, 23 October 2018 (UTC)
Narutolovehinata5, as I pointed out when I suggested the ALT2 and ALT3 hooks, reliable sourcing will need to be found for these facts; some facts and sourcing are not in the article now, nor are the sourced in the various league season articles here on Wikipedia where I found said facts. There hasn't been any attempt to source them in the nominated article, so unless that attempt is made, this could all be moot. BlueMoonset (talk) 21:21, 23 October 2018 (UTC)
Thanks. Please address the sourcing issues so that this can proceed. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:11, 4 November 2018 (UTC)
  • The C of E, it's been a week. Last call to address the sourcing issues for those hooks. Thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 23:22, 10 November 2018 (UTC)
  • I have added a source to it, I still object to this hijacking of the nomination and still feel that one of my original proposed hooks are better because I still do not believe the playoff hook is more interesting than either the stadium or team hooks I proposed. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 08:04, 12 November 2018 (UTC)
  • The article looks better now and it appears that whatever can be sourced has been sourced. The "Teams" section seems to lack references, but I'm willing to let that pass as long as each statement is verified in each team's article (though to be on the safe side, a single general reference, perhaps to the league's website or an official stats site, could also be added here). The same for the tables, which right now are empty. As for the hook suggestions, it was not a "hijacking" but rather a reflection of consensus; although the stadium size hooks was greatly preferred by the nominator, consensus determined that they were not interesting enough to a broad audience and thus had to be substituted with different proposals. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 09:55, 13 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol redirect vote 4.svg New reviewer needed. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:31, 23 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 10

Tribulation 99: Alien Anomalies Under America, Spectres of the Spectrum, Mock Up on Mu

Craig Baldwin with his collection of films
Craig Baldwin with his collection of films

Created by Hinnk (talk). Self-nominated at 03:49, 15 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg Two of these articles are new and are long enough, but Mock Up on Mu is an expansion. Unfortunately it is not long enough, having been expanded from 826 to 3482 characters, and will need to be over 4100 characters to qualify on length. The image is idiosyncratic and properly licensed and the hook facts are interesting and cited inline in each of the articles. The articles are neutral and I detected no copyright or close paraphrasing issues. For a three article hook you need three QPQ reviews. Cwmhiraeth (talk) 07:07, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol delete vote.svg The nominator hasn't edited since last month, and has been unable to provide the requested two additional QPQs. I'd be willing to donate at least one if they do come back, but unless the hook and article issues are addressed soon, or the nominator returns soon, I'm marking this for closure. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 02:12, 2 December 2018 (UTC)
I'm also happy to donate a QPQ if needed, and would propose a two article hook to remove the one that is not 5x expanded.
ALT1 - that the movies Tribulation 99: Alien Anomalies Under America and Spectres of the Spectrum were created out of found footage from the collection of Craig Baldwin (pictured)?
Best, Mifter (talk) 23:56, 3 December 2018 (UTC)
  • Note: Mock Up on Mu wouldn't have to be removed entirely from the original hook, it would just have to be unbolded, and its DYKmake credit removed. Is it helpful to retain it or not? BlueMoonset (talk) 19:33, 7 December 2018 (UTC)
I don't think we lose too much by only mentioning the two movies but do not have a strong opinion either way. Best, Mifter (talk) 03:12, 8 December 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 12

Articles created/expanded on October 13

Government of NCT of Delhi v. Union of India

Building of the Supreme Court of India
Building of the Supreme Court of India
  • Reviewed: I don't think it's needed now; less than five DYK credits (four three).
  • Comment: Created in userspace on 26 September 2018 and moved to mainspace on 13 October 2018.

Created by SshibumXZ (talk). Self-nominated at 00:52, 18 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg Hello @SshibumXZ:, I dropped by to start a review for the nomination, but I noticed there are several maintenance tags for needed citations on the article. Do you have time to work on those, and let me know when it's okay to start a review? Thanks. Flibirigit (talk) 00:45, 27 November 2018 (UTC)

Policy compliance:

QPQ: None required.

Overall: Symbol question.svg Article moved to mainspace on October 12, therefore new enough. Article has some citation needed maintenance tags to be attended to. This appears to be the fourth nomination, therefore no QPQ is required. Flibirigit (talk) 01:09, 27 November 2018 (UTC)

@Flibirigit: I have made the appropriate changes to the article; feel free to proceed with your review. Regards, SshibumXZ (talk · contribs). 13:23, 28 November 2018 (UTC)
Thanks, I will revisit this on Saturday. Sorry for the delay. Flibirigit (talk) 13:53, 28 November 2018 (UTC)
@Flibirigit: no problem; take your time with this review. SshibumXZ (talk · contribs). 00:59, 29 November 2018 (UTC); edited 01:00, 29 November 2018 (UTC) and 01:01, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
I will finish going through this later today. Sorry for the delay. Flibirigit (talk) 05:31, 3 December 2018 (UTC)
Sourcing issues have been rectified. Review still in progress. Flibirigit (talk) 15:35, 3 December 2018 (UTC)
Article appears neutral in tone, not favouring either side of the arguments. Flibirigit (talk) 17:09, 3 December 2018 (UTC)

Copyvio analysis:

  • The judgment.pdf comparions returns a high value of 61% here. The large majority of highlighted areas are either proper nouns or titles, which are not violations. The others are quotations from the actual judgment which are attributed. I see no copyvio concerns on this source.
  • The remaining results from Earwig return values than 20%, which also highlight proper nouns and titles, which are not violations.

None found. Flibirigit (talk) 19:15, 3 December 2018 (UTC)

@SshibumXZ: All five hooks are cited, verified and discussed in the article. I prefer ALT2. I did make several edits to the hooks above and in the article, that I would like to nominator to check. I also noted that in the "Reactions" section, the first sentence "The supreme court's rulings were almost unanimously received favourably." should have a citation or maybe be revised. It is subjective, and likely to be challenged.

Adding my signature to the above. Flibirigit (talk) 19:57, 3 December 2018 (UTC)
@Flibirigit: I am more than fine with your changes and rectifies the single error you made. As far as the statement goes, I think one can infer easily that the judgment was well-received, but, yes, I do get that this might be in contravention with Wikipedia's policies on original research, so, I am fine with removing that line. Also, one more time, thanks for reviewing my DYK nomination for Government of NCT of Delhi v. Union of India; much appreciated, that! Regards, SshibumXZ (talk · contribs). 14:19, 6 December 2018 (UTC)
I am going away on vacation soon, and will have limited computer access for a while. I suggested a different pipe link in the reaction section. Please feel free to change, but leaving a bracketed link without a pipe is against the manual of style for links. Flibirigit (talk) 14:59, 6 December 2018 (UTC)
@Flibirigit: I think that's for disambiguations, though, like "(politician)" or "(artist)". Communist Party of India (Marxist) is a proper noun, so, piping isn't needed. Regards, SshibumXZ (talk · contribs). 16:34, 6 December 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 14

Edgemere Landfill

  • ... that the Edgemere Landfill in New York City was claimed to be "the longest continuously operating dump in the United States", accepting waste from 1938 to 1991? Source: NY Times 1991. "Opened in 1938, Edgemere was the longest continuously operating dump in the United States and perhaps the oldest, the Sanitation Department says."
    • ALT1:... that food waste at New York City's Edgemere Landfill was shredded and poisoned to prevent birds from interfering with operations from nearby JFK Airport? Source: NY Times 1975. "Intensifying their campaign to minimize the bird‐strike hazard at Kennedy International Airport, local authorities have applied for permission to conduct a limited food‐poisoning experiment at a nearby garbage dump. They also are erecting a grid of horizontal wires over the disposal area, which is located at Edgemere in the Rockaways."
    • ALT2:... that the Edgemere Landfill was created because New York City parks commissioner Robert Moses wanted to develop the landfill as parkland? Source: Rockaway Wave. "An extensive landscape waterfront park is planned eventually for the property now being filled by the Department of Sanitation in Edgemere on the Jamaica Bay shore. The site is between Norton and Somerfleld basins north of Almeda avenue and was originally a part of the former state lands under the jurisdiction of the Department of Marine and Aviation.""

Created by Tdorante10 (talk). Nominated by Epicgenius (talk) at 15:36, 14 October 2018 (UTC).


Policy compliance:

Hook eligiblity:

  • Cited: Red XN - Issues with all 3 hooks. The first hook cites a 1991 source which is too old for such a claim. The citation for ALT1 says that permission was applied for but not that it was granted and actioned. The citation for ALT2 doesn't mention Moses and his intentions.
  • Interesting: Red XN - All hooks have reasonable potential but would benefit from work to improve their impact.

Image eligibility:

QPQ: Done.

Overall: Symbol question.svg I am interested in the topic, having written the article dirt which highlighted some other landfills. A lot of work has gone into this page and the authors' efforts are appreciated, Andrew D. (talk) 12:18, 28 October 2018 (UTC)

@Andrew Davidson: Thanks for the review. For ALT0 and ALT1, how about this?
  • ALT0A: ... that when it closed in 1991, the Edgemere Landfill in New York City was claimed to be "the longest continuously operating dump in the United States", having accepted waste since 1938?
  • ALT1A: ... that officials proposed shredding and poisoning food waste at New York City's Edgemere Landfill to prevent birds from interfering with operations from nearby JFK Airport?
For ALT2, Moses is mentioned in a later source. I think it's this one, where Moses remarks, "... lies the new Edgemere Park, the newest and largest park on the Rockaway peninsula. [...] When this area is filled and covered with manufactured topsoil, this park will be done. Eventually there will be an 18-hole golf course and marina together with passive a n d active play areas to care for the recreational needs of all ages in the housing and surrounding neighborhoods." There are other hooks I wanted to put in the article, but I forgot about them. I will do that tomorrow.
As for quotes, all of them are cited. The "toxic landfill" quote, for example, is reference 6, two sentences up. I guess the source was placed at the end of the three sentences so it wouldn't be repeated. Other controversial quotes also have references, but they're just at the end of the sentences. I can fix them tomorrow (put the sources at the end of actual quotes) when I have access to an actual computer. I'd like to have an image in the hook. Maybe this might work? epicgenius (talk) 16:10, 28 October 2018 (UTC)
  • Ok, no rush. Just ping me when it's ready for another look, please. Andrew D. (talk) 18:00, 28 October 2018 (UTC)
  • @Andrew Davidson: I've addressed the quote problem. How about the hooks above, or another hook: epicgenius (talk) 14:58, 30 October 2018 (UTC)
    • ALT3: ...that New York City's Edgemere Landfill was declared a Superfund environmental cleanup site after nearly three thousand 55-gallon metal drums of waste were discovered during a routine excavation? Source: NY Daily News, 1987
    • ALT4: ...that Edgemere Landfill has been proposed for conversion to parkland since the 1950s, though a permanent structure on the site cannot be developed until 2021? Sources: (1) Rockaway Wave, 1958, Moses speech. (2) Rockaway Wave, 2000. "The site is reportedly being monitored and it will be only 21 more years (July, 2021) before a permanent structure can be erected on the site or before it can really be used for the Rockaway public park that has been marked on maps of the area for decades."
Just my two cents, I like ALT3. Tdorante10 (talk) 17:29, 30 October 2018 (UTC)
@Epicgenius: I've been quite busy with other matters but will take another look now. More anon. Andrew D. (talk) 14:45, 16 November 2018 (UTC)
Hi Andrew D., I wanted to check in with this review. If you would like, we can mark it for another reviewer to take a look. Thanks, Mifter (talk) 03:20, 8 December 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 15

Enclave law

Created by Onceinawhile (talk). Self-nominated at 09:32, 15 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Comment:This clearly not true as it applies to Palestinians as well for example minimum wage. --Shrike (talk) 10:08, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
Your statement is incorrect. Per the source provided by Icewhiz below, "a 2008 high court ruling that Israeli labor laws apply to relations between Palestinian workers and Israeli employers in settlements in the West Bank and East Jerusalem". So Palestinians are not covered by these laws unless they are within the Israeli settlement enclaves. Onceinawhile (talk) 13:21, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
  • (ec) Hook issues - there are three issues with the hook. The first is that "Enclave law" is an informal term always or almost always scare-quoted in sources (including the source cited above) - there is no single "enclave law" - it is a very large amalgamation of legislation (that applies Israeli code, e.g. the income tax, on Israeli residents of the Area) and military orders (that extends Israeli legislation to areas under the military commander). Second - saying this "applies only to Israeli settlers" is incorrect - even per the simplistic source cited this also applies to Israeli settlements. For instance, Israeli labour law applies to Palestinian workers in settlements and industrial zones - e.g. And for the roughly 3,300 Palestinians who work in Barkan, the appeal is clear. They are treated equally in the workplace, earning the same salaries and benefits as their Israeli counterparts under Israeli law.NYT or Country Reports on Human Rights Practices for 2011. Third - not all Israeli civil law applies - but large portions - see this source, for examples see - this and this for examples of legislation that do not apply. Icewhiz (talk) 10:17, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
See amended version below, reflecting Icewhiz’s points. Onceinawhile (talk) 13:24, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
I would suggest -
The stmt of "only within Israeli settlements" is incorrect - e.g. Amira Hass who resides in Ramallah is liable for Israeli income tax (as well as other legislation (usually - obligations) applied to Israeli citizens in the area) as it applies to any income of an Israeli citizen in the Area (is also explicitly includes area A) - income tax code, clause 3A. Icewhiz (talk) 13:39, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
This is a good improvement, thanks. Two points:
(1) Under your revised formulation of both Israeli residents and settlements, the word “only” can now be correctly added back.
(2) I haven’t seen a source for the word “process” here, unless applied to the “pipelining” method discussed in the article. So we could say “through a process of pipelining of Enclave law...”
Onceinawhile (talk) 14:09, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
Point 1 - I would avoid "only", as it may be imprecise in other regards (e.g. some possible aspects of roads in area C come to mind) and I don't think it would clear with such wording that portions of Israeli law applies to Palestinians when they are in israeli settlements/zones. As for point 2 - I am not married to "process" (which is also somewhat imprecise) - however I do take issue with "Enclave laws" or "Enclave law" as an entity - there is no such entity at present and hasn't been - what there is (and one of the sources used "pipelining" for only one aspect of this - the military ordinances) is a hodgepodge of Israeli legislation applying obligations to Israeli citizens/residents in the area as well as military ordinances ("pipelines") applying copies of the Israeli law to areas under the authority of the military commander. Rubenstein (who is the original for this quote) described the resulting situation as "enclave law". "enclave law" refers to the situation created by the amalgamation of legislation - but not to the legislation itself (e.g. see the example I linked to from the tax law [17] - at a random point in 1978 the Knesset applied this specific bill to Israeli residents/citizens in the Area by adding a very small clause to bill (they then fixed this in 1994 to clarify the situation due to Oslo, and also updated following unrelated tax changes (e.g. the move from territorial taxation to worldwide personal taxation in 2002). On the VAT bill - [18] - they added a similar clause - but at a different random point in 1986 (and again, updated in 1994 due to Oslo). We could perhaps refer to a resulted in a situation of "Enclave Law" ? Icewhiz (talk) 14:43, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
Lest I be accused of OR above - per Israeli police traffic enforcement guide (page 3 in the PDF) - enforcement in Area C vs. Palestinian citizens is exactly the same as in Israel with the exception of changing the law/ordinance name (פקודת התעבורה turns into צו בדבר התעבורה (יהודה ושומרון) - and "תקנות התעבורה" turns into "תקנות התעבורה (יהודה ושומרון)" - however clause numbering is the same. Icewhiz (talk) 15:28, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
OK. Your “resulted in” formulation would require a restructuring of the sentence - do you have something in mind? Onceinawhile (talk) 17:32, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
How about -
ALT1 ... that Amnon Rubinstein coined the term "Enclave law" to describe the application of large portions of Israeli civil law to Israeli settlements in the Occupied Palestinian territories?
ALT2 ... that the term "Enclave law" has heen used to describe the application of large portions of Israeli civil law to Israelis and Israeli settlements in the West Bank?
The first follows the description in ACRI of what Rubenstein wrote in 87. The second is more contemporary.Icewhiz (talk) 18:53, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
Either fine with me. It would be nice to end ALT1 with "in place of the word apartheid", using the two sources at the bottom of the article, but something tells me you might object to that!
A DYK reviewer is best placed to decide between the two options. Onceinawhile (talk) 20:20, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
Tying in Jeff Halper's or Jonathan Cook's opinions onto Rubenstein would be a BLP issue vs. Rubenstein. Both are probably undue in the article regardless. But I'm happy we're at agreement regarding the hook.Icewhiz (talk) 21:17, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Symbol redirect vote 4.svg New reviewer requested. Onceinawhile (talk) 20:23, 15 October 2018 (UTC)

Symbol possible vote.svg Currently, there is an outstanding merge proposal and multiple cleanup tags in the article. Given the sensitivity of the topic, strongly recommend resolving them before asking for another review. Catrìona (talk) 20:32, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
@Catrìona: Hi Catriona, the clean up is now complete. The merge proposal did not gain consensus, and the tags have been resolved. Onceinawhile (talk) 08:42, 23 October 2018 (UTC)
General eligiblity:
  • New Enough: Green tickY
  • Long Enough: Red XN - Slightly over required 1500 characters readable prose, but I would consider this a stub. It just doesn't give much information.
QPQ: Done.

Overall: Symbol question.svg Striking rejected hooks. Strongly recommend against the word "apartheid" which is highly/unecessarily controversial, even in terms of an analogy. Should it be "Enclave law" or "enclave law"? Catrìona (talk) 09:46, 23 October 2018 (UTC)

Thank you Catrìona. I think lower case is better. Per readable prose, I will lengthen it from the sources. Onceinawhile (talk) 10:13, 23 October 2018 (UTC)
Please note the ongoing discussion at Talk:Enclave_law#Concept_vs_terminology_-_source_dispute. Onceinawhile (talk) 08:22, 2 November 2018 (UTC)
Symbol question.svg - Onceinawhile, given that the article has been moved to Israeli law in the West Bank settlements, please propose updated or new hooks that incorporate the new name. Best, Mifter (talk) 02:06, 4 December 2018 (UTC)
alt1 and alt2 updated/trimmed -
  1. ALT3 ... that Amnon Rubinstein coined the term "enclave law" to describe Israeli law in the West Bank settlements?
  2. ALT4 ... that the term "enclave law" has heen used to describe Israeli law in the West Bank settlements?
Icewhiz (talk) 02:38, 4 December 2018 (UTC)
I support either of these proposal. I would like to suggest that Icewhiz and Shrike are also given DYK credit for this nomination, given their efforts in collaboration here. Onceinawhile (talk) 03:09, 4 December 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 16

Joseph Jagger

Joseph Jagger
Joseph Jagger

Created by Philafrenzy (talk) and Whispyhistory (talk) and Edwardx (talk). Nominated by Philafrenzy (talk) at 21:29, 20 October 2018 (UTC).


Policy compliance:

  • Adequate sourcing: Red XN - Fletcher's book seems to be the most thoroughly researched but is not used for the inline citations. The other sources seem weaker and so details like the year of the bank-breaking isn't clear. Fletcher has a family heirloom with an inscription which is dated 1884 and says that he took four years to do this. I reckon we should be using the best source more to clarify such issues.
  • Neutral: Green tickY
  • Free of copyright violations, plagiarism, and close paraphrasing: Green tickY

Hook eligiblity:

  • Cited: Green tickY
  • Interesting: Green tickY
  • Other problems: Red XN - The hook shouldn't link to the song because it seems unlikely that Jagger was the inspiration for the song. A better link would be to men who broke the bank at Monte Carlo, which explains the concept (and which also needs updating to include Jagger). I'll set this up as ALT1 for clarity.
QPQ: Done.

Overall: Symbol question.svg It's a good story and I'm tempted to get Fletcher's book myself to read more. Perhaps we can share a copy at the meetup? Has someone ordered it yet? Andrew D. (talk) 21:12, 28 October 2018 (UTC)

I don't have Fletcher's book, and haven't ordered it. The main source for the article is the piece in The Times which was clearly drawn from Fletcher's book, so I took that to be the most authoritative source for the year 1881 as I thought she and The Times must be right. There are multiple earlier sources that give slightly different years for the event, including Brewers, but I took them all to be less reliable than the recent biography. We could certainly get the book and someone should but that might have to wait until the article is expanded to GA. As The Times clearly drew their article from Fletcher's book, I feel the sourcing is reasonable at this stage. Philafrenzy (talk) 10:44, 29 October 2018 (UTC)

My apologies if I am not using this page correctly. I have just edited the Joseph Jagger page as I am the author of a newly published biography of him. I have changed some points that are factually wrong according to my research and I have cited my book as the source of key facts rather than The Times journalist who interviewed me. I hope that does not infringe marketing policies? I wanted the source to be as accurate as possible but don't want it to seem like self-promotion. And thank you for the very nice comments here about my book!I hope that the changes are acceptable Anne C Fletcher (talk) 18:45, 20 November 2018 (UTC)Anne Fletcher, author From the Mill to MOnte Carlo

Articles created/expanded on October 17


Created by Scope creep (talk). Self-nominated at 03:41, 17 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg--
  • Plagiarisation and Close paraphrasing is very-evident.
  • semi-acoustic instrument, with the sound being generated in the traditional way by striking strings is copied in toto from the source.
  • Although having no sound board, it was much lighter is copied in toto from the source.
  • Original research
  • Usage of the words:-- micro-hammer, eighteen microphones et cetera.
  • Many lines are un-sourced. They are (probably) sourced in some of the references but as much as inline cites are not required, it's optimum to use them.
  • Prose form is quite poor.
  • The Construction section starts with:--The was semi-acoustic instrument which is meaningless.
  • The Marketing section again starts with:-- Bechstein reportedly built 150 copies of which exist today which is meaningless.The same can be said about the last line:-- and was restored in 2007 at the technical Museum Vienna ready to play and is used for concert purposes.
  • The entire paragraph reads like a marketing brochure of the piano (viz The stop has been refined by the micro pounding...., This avoids the knocking noise...... et al).A lot trivial details ( that typically hit the string at a force of 5%....) are noted.
  • Additionally, the term neo-petrof is used out of nowhere and is not even wiki-linked/ explained at a foot-note.
  • I have no idea about the 4th source.
  • This can be improved, quite a lot.Use the press-reviews and exploit the many rigorous sources which mention it, without getting bogged down into trivialities.And above all, copy-edit whatever you have written till now. (I will try to invest my own efforts, if possible:-) )
  • On a note, I have not even bothered to find out about QPQ:-)WBGconverse 07:01, 19 October 2018 (UTC)
Thanks WBG. That was bit of a wake up call. I never realised it was so bad. Thanks. Is it possible to take each in turn,
  • I can get rid of the plagiarism by rewording.
  • Regarding mirco hammer, I took this from the image, No. 5, mikrohammer. I thought that would be self evident. I have explained mechanics.
  • The stop has been refined by the micro pounding, technical detail of the first electric piano.
  • 5% was what made it unique, and its mentioned in a few sources. Explained.
  • I have reordered it and tried to address the points raised. scope_creep (talk) 08:36, 19 October 2018 (UTC)
  • QPQ doesnt seem to apply, as this is my first DYK. scope_creep (talk) 13:44, 19 October 2018 (UTC)
  • @Winged Blades of Godric: @Scope creep: What is the status of this nomination? It has been one month since the nominator's last post. I glanced at the page and see just a block of text. Subheads are the first thing needed. You may wish to apply for copyediting help at WP:GOCE. Yoninah (talk) 20:05, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Yoninah I think this DYK can probably be closed. I submitted it far too early. I started the article very late at night when I was sleeping, and submitted it, when it still needed a lot of work. user:Winged Blades of Godric came in, reviewed the DYK and rewrote the article, which I thought was nice and really cool and I copy-edited later, and later still added sections as requested. I don't think DYK is for me, as I tend to take some time to create an article, usually months, e.g. Platt Report 1959. Thanks. Please close this. scope_creep (talk) 00:24, 20 November 2018 (UTC)
  • @Scope creep: actually, with your reorganization, the article looks in better shape now. I'd like to re-review it in a little while, as it seems Winged Blades of Godric has recused himself by rewriting the article. I have added him to the DYK co-credits. Yoninah (talk) 08:02, 20 November 2018 (UTC)
ok scope_creep (talk) 09:16, 20 November 2018 (UTC)
  • OK, I've gone over the article and added a few "citation needed" tags to information that needs to be sourced. I would also like you to suggest a new hook – something that will "hook" the reader's interest, not an explanatory sentence. Thanks, Yoninah (talk) 16:55, 20 November 2018 (UTC)
  • I will update the article tomorrow. Yip, any help with the hook is cool. scope_creep (talk) 21:37, 20 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Yoninah that is the citations added to the article as requested. There from a journal article, that discusses the design of the piano.scope_creep (talk) 16:28, 21 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 18

Masterpiece (Basshunter song)

Created by Eurohunter (talk). Self-nominated at 14:06, 25 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg The article is new enough, long enough, neutrally written, and has lots of inline citations, which is all good. There also appear to be no identifiable copyright concerns. But this nomination needs to be formatted correctly in keeping with the guidelines. Specifically, as per WP:DYKHOOK, the hook should link to the article itself (in this case Masterpiece (Basshunter song)) and the article should be bolded. The grammar in the hook (as well as the article) should be fixed too. The hook seems to be accurate as per the source (CelebMix) but I am uncertain about whether it is a reliable source. And just in case Eurohunter has 5 or more DYK credits (doesn't seem like it from their talk page archives), they need to do a QPQ. IntoThinAir (talk) 03:57, 26 October 2018 (UTC)
    • @IntoThinAir: I fixed hook formatting and grammar but I'm not sure if it's fixed. As I understood there is problem in the article too. Do you mean only this sentence or something else? CelebMix has over 285,000 followers on Twitter (follows itself almost 100,000) and has a draft in Wikipedia and they oranize interviews with artists. Eurohunter (talk) 08:03, 26 October 2018 (UTC)
      • It looks like CelebMix (and specifically articles on the website written by Jonathan Currinn) is considered a reliable source, so that's not an issue. I am glad you improved the hook, but some more information is needed regarding the song, so I think the hook should say something like "...that the lyrics of the 2018 Basshunter song "Masterpiece" reference the 2009 video game League of Legends?". With regard to the grammar in the article, I have just edited it to deal with some (really most) of the issues I noticed when I was first writing this review (e.g. "revelated" is not a word). But I didn't check the "Reception" section for syntax/grammar/spelling issues, so you should try to do so and fix any errors you may notice. IntoThinAir (talk) 13:34, 26 October 2018 (UTC)
        • @IntoThinAir: Thanks. Unfortunatelly I would never realise I have done these mistakes and I can't improve it any soon in new cases like that. I adjusted a hook as you showed me. Eurohunter (talk) 13:52, 27 October 2018 (UTC)
@IntoThinAir: I extended information about lyrics. Could you check it? I think it could be "and comes from itself" than "and is taken itself". I had also no better idea how to add information about usage of voices. Eurohunter (talk) 11:04, 26 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 21

Sozusagen grundlos vergnügt

Created by Gerda Arendt (talk). Self-nominated at 15:19, 28 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg The full review is to come, but what do you think about these alternative hook suggestions?
Personally I find the translated title a more interesting fact than the poem being published after her death. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 02:15, 14 November 2018 (UTC)
As you like it. - Sadly, I found no other translation. This one is from a blog, and I am not sure about copyright. I am sure that we don't capitalise when we only give a translation, so changed that. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:40, 14 November 2018 (UTC)
Symbol redirect vote 4.svg The article is new enough and long enough, and it is adequately sourced. It is neutral and free from close paraphrasing. As mentioned above, I don't really find the first hook interesting as it's very common for works to be published after the author's death. My issue with my own proposals is that the translation is cited to a Wordpress blog, and I don't know if the blog is run by a reliable source on the subject and/or is authorized to host the poem. However, I don't really see much else hook-worthy in the article so it could be our best option here. As I proposed ALT1 and ALT1a, a new reviewer is need to choose a hook here. QPQ is still pending, so this can't be approved until one is provided. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:55, 15 November 2018 (UTC)
No new reviewer is needed, as no new facts were added, just reworded. I am sure we can say without citation problem that it can be translated that way. I would probably have stayed closer to the Herman and said "So-to-speak causelessly merry", but that's very minor. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 10:33, 15 November 2018 (UTC)
Symbol question.svg - The "published after her death" need a cite. Also, I agree the translation ref is not the best, if we are able to find another one we should likely switch it. Best, Mifter (talk) 01:25, 7 December 2018 (UTC)
I duplicated the ref to the sentence. - If I had found another translation, I'd happily used it. Help, anybody? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:31, 7 December 2018 (UTC)

Social entrepreneurship in South Asia

Created by Wickersong (talk). Self-nominated at 23:02, 21 October 2018 (UTC).

Policy compliance:

Hook eligiblity:

  • Cited: Red XN - no
  • Interesting: Red XN - not really

QPQ: Red XN - not needed, users first DYK
Overall: Symbol delete vote.svg Beeblebrox (talk) 21:42, 22 October 2018 (UTC)

Symbol possible vote.svg I’m concerned with the overall quality of the writing. There are several passages containing broken, unclear, or confusing language, and I have to agree with the tag regarding undue weight. This is certainly a valid topic for an article, but this article seems a bit narrow and focuses only on a few specific organizations. This does not necessarily disqualify from from DYK, but it isn’t optimal to have such an article featured on the main page. Also, please provide a source which directly verifies the hook. Beeblebrox (talk) 22:27, 22 October 2018 (UTC)

Hi Beeblebrox, I'm currently working on this for an educational assignment and so am in the midst of heavily revising this article. I will work to address the issues with writing quality as well as undue weight as I expand on this article and improve upon it. Hopefully then it can be optimal. I also fixed the hooks up a bit more to hopefully make it more interesting and added citations. How quickly do I need to revise this article to still have it up for consideration? Wickersong (talk) 23:15, 22 October 2018 (UTC)

Once you’re “in the system” so to speak I think you’re good as far as timing, there isn’t really a deadline. Beeblebrox (talk) 04:22, 23 October 2018 (UTC)
  • @Beeblebrox: The nominator hasn't edited in over a week; have your concerns been addressed? If not, and/or the nominator doesn't return soon, I will mark this for closure. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 03:53, 2 November 2018 (UTC)
The hook and alt are now cited, so that’s half of it, but the article itself hasn’t been improved. I’m afraid they took my comment about timing a bit too literally, obviously it is expected that the issues will be fixed at some point but it looks as though they’ve walked away for now. Beeblebrox (talk) 20:51, 2 November 2018 (UTC)
Hi all I am working on it today and over the next few days/this week to improve the article itself. I've been unable to work on it because of school. Happy to get any more feedback @Beeblebrox: and @Narutolovehinata5: as I revise. Will let you both know once I've reached a good point with this article. Wickersong (talk) 15:49, 3 November 2018 (UTC)
@Beeblebrox: and @Narutolovehinata5: I've revised the article quite a bit. Please review and let me know whether there's anything else I should fix in order to perfect my nomination for DYK Wickersong (talk) 16:04, 14 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 23

Li Lianda

  • ... that pharmacologist Li Lianda claimed that a pharmaceutical company's product was unsafe, but lost a lawsuit brought by the company? Source: Sina Finance

Created by Zanhe (talk). Self-nominated at 05:28, 28 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg @Zanhe: Honestly I don't find the proposed hook interesting: it's very common for people to employees to claim that their employer's product or service is unsafe, and lose lawsuits. In fact, it's also common for people to lose lawsuits on claims about company safety. We may need a new hook here. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:50, 15 November 2018 (UTC)
  • @Narutolovehinata5: I respectfully disagree. Li Lianda was not an employee of the pharmaceutical company (Tasly), but one of China's best known pharmacologists and an academician. It's highly unusual for an academician to publicly denounce a major company's product and then lose an ensuing lawsuit. Please reconsider. -Zanhe (talk) 05:54, 23 November 2018 (UTC)
@Zanhe: The hook could have potentially worked if the company was internationally well-known, but alas. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 09:23, 23 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 24

Dui Bigha Jomi

Rabindranath Tagore
Rabindranath Tagore
  • Reviewed: Doing...

Created by Titodutta (talk). Self-nominated at 07:17, 25 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg, new, copyvio ok, could be expanded and improved further. Once QPQ done, ok for dyk, picture okay. Hook is in article and sourced. Whispyhistory (talk) 22:08, 30 October 2018 (UTC)
Symbol question.svg - Length, Date, Cite, and Earwigs check. Image appears to be freely licensed as PD-Old. Titodutta, once a QPQ is done, this will be good to approve. Best, Mifter (talk) 04:47, 8 December 2018 (UTC)

Vincent Toro

Created by Audreyspell (talk). Self-nominated at 19:47, 24 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg The subject appears to be notable as the winner of an important poetry award, the Norma Farber First Book Award. (The Sawtooth Poetry Prize is not notable and should not be mentioned in the hook.) However, the sourcing in the article is mostly based on user-generated content (pw.org and kwelijournal.org) and there is no detail on his personal life or his notability, aside from what the page creator is writing in a promotional tone. At this time, the article does not meet Rule D7 IMO. The hook is also not the most interesting ("Did you know that X won the Y award?"). Image is freely licensed. No QPQ needed for nominator with less than 5 DYK credits. Yoninah (talk) 21:11, 11 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 25

1994 Gambian coup d'état

5x expanded by Ira.morga3 (talk). Self-nominated at 03:32, 25 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg @Ira.morga3: The article was nominated the day 5x expansion happened, so it meets the date criterion. I wasn't able to find any close paraphrasing. This is the nominator's first nomination so a QPQ is not required. Although I suppose both hooks are potentially interesting, I have concerns with both: for the first, I'm not sure if bloodless coups are really unusual as I'm aware it's happened before in other places. The second hook might be too obtuse for people unfamiliar with political science: it would be advisable to add a link to Waves of democracy in the said hook. Otherwise, both are cited inline: ALT0 reference is verified, while I can't access ALT1's source so for now it is accepted AGF. The article is of an appropriate length, but I would suggest that the "The Paradox to the Third Wave of Democratization" section be rewritten in a more neutral tone. As for the "The Paradox to the Third Wave of Democratization" claim itself, I would suggest that some background be written about it (i.e. who formulated that term, and in what context) as the term is discussed rather abruptly. I would also suggest that the "Coup" and "Discontent in the Gambia" sections be switched (i.e. "Discontent in the Gambia" comes before "Coup", to give background). This will be good to go once these issues have been addressed. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:45, 15 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 27

Gert Westphal

Katia and Thomas Mann
Katia and Thomas Mann
  • ... that when Gert Westphal recited works by Thomas Mann, his widow Katia (pictured with her husband) called him "des Dichters oberster Mund" (the poets principal voice)? Source: several

Created by Gerda Arendt (talk). Self-nominated at 22:13, 4 November 2018 (UTC).

Worked on it, dropped a few that to know seems less relevant in English. I have a problem with Schallplattenkritik, because they have only an archive to search, and I am too stupid to find more than two. (it seems to go by year, but when I insert 2005, I get again to 2002, for example.) I am sure though the others are as correct. Help? I found referencing for some of our awards articles rather sad, I must say. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 10:27, 15 November 2018 (UTC)
Narutolovehinata5, please look again. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:16, 23 November 2018 (UTC)
Seems to be better now. The article seems to meet all the requirements (new enough, long enough, good sourcing, no paraphrasing, QPQ, etc.), and I am accepting in good faith the German language sources. My only concern is the hook: what's the context of being called "poet's principal voice"? I think the hook could be reworded a bit better better. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 11:08, 26 November 2018 (UTC)
What she means is that when you hear the speaker you seem to hear the author, but it's not in the sources, because a German would understand it without explanation. - I appreciate alternatives, very generally so. English is not my native language, so I have a hard time struggling for something better, never quite sure how that will be understood. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:39, 26 November 2018 (UTC)
Gerda Arendt and Narutolovehinata5, might this wording come across more clearly?
ALT1 ... that after a reading where Gert Westphal recited works by Thomas Mann, his widow Katia (pictured with her husband) called him "des Dichters oberster Mund" (the poets principal voice)?
Best, Mifter (talk) 22:04, 8 December 2018 (UTC)
Yes for me, thank you! --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:06, 8 December 2018 (UTC)
@Mifter: Honestly no, as it did not address my initial concern, which involves the words "'des Dichters oberster Mund' (the poets principal voice)". Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:49, 9 December 2018 (UTC)
Narutolovehinata5, thanks for the input. Given it, I'm not sure I'm understanding your concern. Would you mind expounding a bit on it? Thanks, Mifter (talk) 01:15, 9 December 2018 (UTC)
@Mifter: To be frank, I don't see how being called "the poet's principal voice", especially of a poet who to be honest isn't really that well-known, is interesting to a broad audience. And even if it was, I don't think the German part is necessary, we could have just simply gone with "the poet's principal voice". But I'm starting to think that we may need to propose a new hook here. Narutolovehinata5 t
If people don't Thomas Mann, the more imortant to mention him, simply The German writer of the 20th century, Nobel Prize laureate, and lived in the US in exile. (Looking at his article stats: more views on a "bad" day than my average DYK, - so I don't believe "isn't really that well-known). --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:14, 9 December 2018 (UTC)

ccsdnew 01:17, 9 December 2018 (UTC)

Thanks for the clarification! When I was looking at the article earlier, it appeared that there is some material in the article that could be good for other hooks. I'll see what I can put together. Best, Mifter (talk) 01:22, 9 December 2018 (UTC)
ALT2 ... that literary critic Marcel Reich-Ranicki described Gert Westphal as "probably the best recitator in German"?
A slightly different angle. Gerda Arendt, I don't have access to the source nor do I speak German. Does this hook and its quote work for you? Also, Narutolovehinata5, any thoughts? Thanks, Mifter (talk) 01:34, 9 December 2018 (UTC)
That's a good hook for those who know the critic and thus know that he was The literay critic. (and much feared). Now we can of course say (again) that we don't have to lure others to that article ;) - I still prefer mine, of course, because 1) I love women being mentioned and pictured, 2) even more so in partnership, 3) I think Thomas Mann will be better known than RR, and put a time stamp on the whole thing. - I experienced Westphal once, live, and can support all the praise, unreliably so ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:06, 9 December 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 28

Rosalinda González Valencia

Source: "En 1996 Rosalinda González Valencia se casó con el que se convertiría en el hombre fuerte del Cártel Jalisco Nueva Generación, Nemesio Oseguera Cervantes / [English]: "In 1996 Rosalinda González Valencia married the one who would become the strong man of the Jalisco Cartel Nueva Generación, Nemesio Oseguera Cervantes." (El Universal) [English] "Known as “El Mencho,” Oseguera has risen to become Mexico’s most-wanted drug lord after Joaquin “El Chapo” Guzman was extradited to the United States last year to face trial." (Reuters)

Moved to mainspace by MX (talk). Self-nominated at 21:32, 29 October 2018 (UTC).

  • The hook really says nothing about her. Yoninah (talk) 00:14, 28 November 2018 (UTC)
  • I disagree. Either way, she's best known for being married to El Mencho. What do you suggest I do with the hook then? MX () 03:33, 28 November 2018 (UTC)
Although I suppose the hook is interesting, I see Yoninah's point. It implies that that's her claim to fame, as opposed to something that she did in her own right. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 02:53, 2 December 2018 (UTC)
From what I've gathered, being married to El Mencho is what she is best known for. The majority of the sources have esposa (English: wife) on the titles. That means her marriage with El Mencho is what the sources find most notable to describe her. The Latin American drug world is still very male-dominated, so I'm not surprised sources describe her like this on their titles. MX () 17:26, 2 December 2018 (UTC)
If being a spouse is what she's best known for, wouldn't that fall under WP:NOTINHERITED? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 20:19, 2 December 2018 (UTC)
No. She's received significant coverage for her suspected role in the CJNG as well (but sources always start by introducing her as El Mencho's wife, which brings us to my original point). If I were to propose a hook about her alleged criminal activities, this would get flagged on NPOV violations. I'm thinking we could also copy any of the hooks of her brother (except ALT0 and ALT4, which does not apply to her). Any thoughts? MX () 21:59, 2 December 2018 (UTC)
Honestly I'm not a fan of the hooks proposed here as they seem to focus more on other people than herself. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 12:00, 3 December 2018 (UTC)
  • ALT1 ... that the trial of Rosalinda González Valencia is held behind closed doors because the Mexican government is presenting sensitive evidences about a drug cartel? Source: [Spanish] "Los fiscales de la PGR solicitaron al juez Zeferín Hernández llevar la diligencia a puerta cerrada porque la secrecía de los datos que expusieron es clave para el éxito de la investigación que realiza contra el CJNG." / [English]: "Prosecutors from the PGR asked Judge Zeferín Hernández to take the trial behind closed doors because the secrecy of the data they exposed is key to the success of the investigation carried out against the CJNG." (El Universal)
  • ALT2 ... that Rosalinda González Valencia has 17 siblings, giving rise to their clan nickname "Cuinis", referring to a prolific local ground squirrel? Source: [Spanish] "Los Cuinis son un grupo delincuencial conformado por miembros de una misma familia que inició sus operaciones a principios de los 90 ... El sobrenombre de esta familia se debe a una ardilla de la zona a la que los lugareños conocen como cuiniki , su particularidad es que en cada parto suelen tener de 12 a 14 crías." / [English]: "The Cuinis are a criminal group formed by members of the same family that began operations in the early 90's ... The nickname of this family is due to a squirrel from the area that locals know as cuiniki, its peculiarity is that in each birth they usually have 12 to 14 offspring." (El Economista)
  • Here are two new hooks. Not sure if ALT1 is NPOV compliant, but that's the one I like the most. ALT2 is meh since it loses the impact of the previous hooks. Let me know what you think. MX () 14:53, 3 December 2018 (UTC)
The best option here might be ALT2, but it needs to be reworded as its flow is very abrupt. I don't like ALT1 as closed-door trials are not uncommon and in fact are the norm in some countries. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 01:01, 4 December 2018 (UTC)
Would you be kind enough to reword it the way you think it should be? Have no idea what you're talking about. Thanks, MX () 16:14, 4 December 2018 (UTC)
I'd probably drop the part about 17 siblings and instead focus on the clan nickname part. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 11:42, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
Got it. At that point the impact of the hook is lost... MX () 16:38, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
Or if you really want to do the 17 siblings part, you'd probably need to drop the squirrel nickname part instead and say something about the siblings as a whole. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 23:21, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
At that point we're stuck with Yoninah's initial concern that the hook says "nothing about her". Not sure what other hooks to suggest without being on the borderline of a NPOV / BLP violation. I'll be out of town in a week with no access to Wikipedia until 2019. Hopefully we can come to a resolution soon. MX () 23:27, 9 December 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on October 30

Max Rose (politician)

[[File:|120x133px |Max Rose ]]
  • Comment: Strongly prefer the article to go on the main page before November 6, when the election occurs

Converted from a redirect by Philepitta (talk) and La comadreja (talk). Nominated by La comadreja (talk) at 20:44, 30 October 2018 (UTC).

  • Comment: This also reeks of advertising quite a bit. Really recommend findig an alternative hook. Juxlos (talk) 09:48, 1 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol possible vote.svg Putting on hold until either after the deletion review ends, or after the election (whichever comes first). Note that the article is currently a redirect pending the DR outcome. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 11:16, 1 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol redirect vote 4.svg As the subject has won his election bid and the article has been restored, this is ready for a new review. Courtesy ping Serial Number 54129 and Juxlos. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 13:58, 7 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Thank you Narutolovehinata5. It should probably fail again as the hook is clearly incorrect. We are at least lucky that the DRV kept it off the front page before the election, thus denying the oxygen of publicity so desperately wanted, it would seem, in the nom. ——SerialNumber54129 14:19, 7 November 2018 (UTC)
Symbol possible vote.svg @Serial Number 54129: Looking at the article now, I don't really see much wrong with it: it does appear to be adequately sourced and neutrally written (at least right now). My main issue is the hook proposals itself: as mentioned here, they appear to have a promotional, even campaigning, tone. My suggestion is that a variation of ALT0, perhaps focusing on his military career instead of his campaign, would option here. @Philepitta and La comadreja: In the interest of disclosure, hooks are prohibited from being run 30 days before a subject's election date unless all major candidates are featured as well; as such, the request to be featured before November 6 would have been disallowed. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 10:01, 13 November 2018 (UTC)
Indeed, my issue was only ever with the spammy hook, not the article. Agree with you that the issue could be resolved with a hook that focusses on something other than his political career. ——SerialNumber54129 10:23, 13 November 2018 (UTC)
@Serial Number 54129: I think the best option here is ALT0 since it's more about his military career and the part about being a candidate is only a descriptor. Do you have any ideas on how to reword it? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 11:11, 13 November 2018 (UTC)
Max Rose won the election. I would reword it as: ... that Max Rose, U.S. Representative of Staten Island and South Brooklyn, is a veteran of the Afghanistan conflict and served as chief of staff at a health care nonprofit which runs clinics around New York City?
Thing is, he doesn't actually becomes Representative until January, so that might need to be reworded depending on when this will be promoted. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 02:56, 14 November 2018 (UTC)
So maybe we could call him "representative-elect"?
  • Symbol redirect vote 4.svg New reviewer needed for ALT hooks; it's been three weeks with no previous reviewer return to review the updated hooks. (To avoid confusion, I've renumbered the newly proposed hooks.) BlueMoonset (talk) 05:29, 8 December 2018 (UTC)
Symbol question.svg - Length, Date, Cites, and Earwigs check. However, a QPQ must be done for this to be approved. Mifter (talk) 06:32, 8 December 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on November 2

Economic history of the Philippines under Ferdinand Marcos

Former Philippine President Ferdinand Marcos
Former Philippine President Ferdinand Marcos
  • ... that the Philippine economy under Ferdinand Marcos faced its first major economic crisis because of heavy government borrowing in the lead-up to Marcos' 1969 re-election campaign? Marcos assumed the presidency only in 1965, when things started to spiral downward in the late 1960s as existing policies no longer encouraged rapid growth. The would-be dictator then pursued an aggressive, expensive run for a second term by foraying into the public treasury to boost his campaign, buy votes and threaten voters. The peso crashed in late 1969, and by the dawn of the following year it lost half its value, Conrado de Quiros wrote in "Dead Aim." ....The 1960s crisis, for economists Arsenio Balisacan and Hall Hill, "was triggered by one politician's particularly shameless efforts to maintain a grasp on the reins of the political machinery. - Diola, Camille. "Debt, deprivation and spoils of dictatorship
    • ALT1:... that the Philippine economy under Ferdinand Marcos saw GDP go from nearly 9% growth in 1976, to a recession where the economy contracted by 7.3% for two years, 1984 and 1985? Source:Gross domestic product (GDP) growth peaked right after Marcos’s declaration of Martial law in 1972, reaching nearly 9 percent in 1973 and 1976, partly driven by a commodity boom when the prices of major Philippine commodity exports like coconut and sugar went up. However, it was also under Marcos when the country hit the worst recession in history: a 7.3-percent contraction for 2 successive years in 1984 and 1985, as his grip on power waned. - Guido, Edson Joseph; de los Reyes, Che (2017), "The best of times? Data debunk Marcos's economic 'golden years'", ABSCBN News and Public Affairs
    • ALT2:...that the nosedive of the Philippine economy under Ferdinand Marcos in 1983 traces its roots to debt-driven growth, mostly during Marcos' second term, and during the earliest years of martial law? Source: "This strategy of borrowing heavily was “peculiar to the Marcos period” and carried great risk, De Dios said. It “produced historically impressive growth,” but also “created the conditions for the big collapse later,” he added....The turning point came when the US entered a recession in the third quarter of 1981 and increased interest rates, bloating the cost of Philippine borrowings. Debt servicing then became very difficult for Manila, as with other debt-dependent countries in Latin America. The economy began to decline in 1981, proving debt-driven growth was unsustainable. The country’s exports at the time failed to keep pace with the ballooning debt. - Guido, Edson Joseph; de los Reyes, Che (2017), "The best of times? Data debunk Marcos's economic 'golden years'", ABSCBN News and Public Affairs

Created by Alternativity (talk). Self-nominated at 08:55, 7 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg - It appears the article was move to another name. Alternativity, can you please update the hooks to reflect the new title (if needed)? Thanks, Mifter (talk) 07:11, 8 December 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on November 4

Oranges & Lemons (album)

  • ... that XTC's 1989 album Oranges & Lemons reimagines 1960s psychedelic music with modern instrumentation and technology? Source: "Partridge's ethos for this album appears to be a continuation of the Dukes Of Stratosphear aesthetic -- exploring the sound and colors of their '60s influences -- but he makes the unfortunate step of trying to filter it through modern instrumentation and technology." (link)
  • Comment: save for February 27, 2019 (the date of the album's 50th anniversary)

5x expanded by Ilovetopaint (talk). Self-nominated at 20:24, 10 November 2018 (UTC).

Policy compliance:

QPQ: None required.

Overall: Symbol question.svg Nominator's first nomination so no QPQ needed. Earwigs gives a >70% score but that's because of the quotations, that are cited inline. This will be good to go once the Singles section is sourced. Unfortunately, per the special occassion hook guidelines, special date requests should generally be made no more than six weeks before the requested date, and February 2019 is too far away. Thus, the request has to be respectfully declined. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:01, 23 November 2018 (UTC)

  • Done (removed the singles section) --Ilovetopaint (talk) 18:01, 1 December 2018 (UTC)

Raising hands

  • ... that raising hands is a gesture common to slaves, statues and students? Source: "when slaves accompanied their masters to public events, they were required to hold their hand up if they needed to be excused" [19]Source: "The Solid Rock Church, a Christian megachurch, had a 19-metre tall statue named ‘King of Kings’, which depicted Jesus with his arms raised in the air." [20]Source: "One study on hand-raising illustrated that students almost always looked directly at the teacher when raising their hands, and only looked away just before lowering their hand." [21]

Created/expanded by Giselle136. Nominated by Fransplace at 02:27, 16 November 2018 (UTC).

  • NB: note to reviewer - it'd be nice if the seven-day rule could be relaxed as this was part of an educational program :) Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 05:11, 18 November 2018 (UTC)
Symbol question.svg Detailed, well-sources article, no copyvio obvious. Hook: "common to slaves" - I first thought the hand was raised towards the slaves. s-s-s is nice, but how how about yoga and blessing? - Images in the article, I don't like beginning with Hitlergruß which comes late in history, and believe we would crucifixion images where we can see more raised hands. - A little overdue is no problem for me. Why no link to the nominator? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:52, 7 December 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on November 5

Charlie McGeever

Created by Leitirlad (talk). Self-nominated at 10:34, 8 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg The article is new enough, long enough, stable, and neutrally written. Most of it is sourced, and the hook fact is cited inline and verified. No images so no comment on that. Nominator's first DYKN so no QPQ is required. However, some sentences and the entire "Honours" section lack footnotes. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:45, 23 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol delete vote.svg Normally, I wouldn't be marking for closure a nomination relatively so soon after my review. However, the nominator has not edited since the day of the nomination (almost a month ago), and the sourcing issues require either him or another editor who is well-versed in football to fix. Taking into account the length of inactivity and the editor's editing pattern, it seems unlikely that they will be able to return soon enough for the problems to be addressed promptly. As such, I regretfully mark this nomination for closure. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:57, 30 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on November 6

Articles created/expanded on November 8

Bleed India with a Thousand Cuts

Created by DBigXray (talk). Self-nominated at 20:46, 14 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg - Looking at the article, I'm concerned as a number of the sources appear to be non-neutral (strongly pro-India) which then comes through in the article. I did a bit of cleanup but more is needed. DBigXray please see if we can find other neutral sources to add and use to bolster the article. Thanks, Mifter (talk) 01:24, 9 December 2018 (UTC)
To provide some examples that might require new/expanded sourcing or rephrasing (thanks to Kautilya3 for doing a lot of work on the article in the interim).
  • "The war clarified that Kashmir could no longer be taken from India by a conventional war." is cited to an article by a Major General in the Indian Army which is written with a pro-India tone and as an authoritative statement in the article should be qualified or bolstered with additional cites.
  • "Presently the Islamic fundamentalists in Bangladesh and Pakistan, controlled by the ISI, have joined forces to carry out terrorist attacks on India." is cited to a book that describes the war as India's "triumphant victory" which had Pakistan "down on its knees" along with numerous other clearly pro-India remarks.
  • "India was able to overcome its losses without weakening of its strength. The International community abhors Jihad. Pakistan's continuation of its covert war, called Jihad in Kashmir has caused loss of international support for Pakistan's Kashmir policy. This loss of support is evident even in the Muslim countries. Every Jihadist attack reduces Pakistan's moral high ground." needs additional citations in general, reads somewhat like an essay, and is presently cited to an article that reads like an op-ed in a section entitled "Views from Pakistan" with a subheadline that reads partly "two Pakistani commentators present the other side of the argument".
Best, Mifter (talk) 17:06, 9 December 2018 (UTC)

Peng Shilu

Peng Shilu in 2004
Peng Shilu in 2004
  • Reviewed: exempt from QPQ

Created by Lvhis (talk). Self-nominated at 19:46, 8 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg I am not sure I understand the hook - Peng Shilu, then mentions Huang Xuhua and I'm not sure which of them was jailed? MPJ-DK (talk) 01:13, 8 December 2018 (UTC)
Thank you MPJ-DK for your review. I revised the hook. Please check it to see if it is okay now, thanks. Lvhis (talk) 19:01, 8 December 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on November 9

Ústredňa Židov

  • ... that the Slovak Jewish Council was taken over by a resistance group, despite having been set up by the Nazis? Source: Nazis forcing the Jews to form the group, Fatran 1994, p. 165.; for the takeover, Fatran 1994, pp. 187–188.

Created by Catrìona (talk) and The Anome (talk). Nominated by Catrìona (talk) at 22:30, 9 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg @Catrìona and The Anome: I'm trying to review this article but I'm coming up against a question of eligibility. Looking at the edit history it was created on 1 October with material copied from Bratislava Working Group, virtually blanked on 9 November and then re-written. The two versions don't seem to be fundamentally different however. Apart from this, I also have a query in regards to Slovak Jewish Council. The term, while used in the hook, is not used in the article, only Jewish Council is used but, according to the intro, the translation for Ústredňa Židov is Jewish Center. Could you please shed some light on these two queries? Turismond (talk) 23:52, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  • I may have found the answer to my first question. Was it moved to mainspace on 9 November, which would make it eligible? As to further reviewing the article, article and hook length, neutrality and QPQ are ok. No copyright violations found. Offline sources accepted in good faith. I'm struggling however to find was taken over by a resistance group, despite having been set up by the Nazis in the article (other than the intro), all I can find is effectively uniting the Working Group and the ÚŽ, which is unreferenced. Could a the article be amended to include a referenced version of the hook's statement? Turismond (talk) 01:15, 18 November 2018 (UTC)

Dena Vane-Kirkman

  • ... that when magazine editor Dena Vane-Kirkman was robbed at gunpoint by a burglar, she told him "Your mother would be ashamed of you"?
    • ALT1:... that ...?
  • Reviewed: To be done

Created by Philafrenzy (talk). Self-nominated at 18:48, 12 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol delete vote.svg The article, while new and long enough, has a few issues. The red links are a bit of an eyesore. I would shorten the lead to, "Dena Lesley Vane-Kirkman (1 May 1944 – 19 October 2018) was a British magazine editor, best known for her work on Woman's World in New York in the 1980s". There's also the troubling fact that hardly any results turn up for "Dena Vane-Kirkman" on internet searches. There's the Times obituary (behind a pay wall) and then this article. That's pretty much it. There's this notice for her funeral, which is cited in the article. Clearly not a reliable source. Sorry but I highly doubt she meets notability criteria. - HappyWaldo (talk) 22:38, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
The Times gave her a full page obituary, they don't do that for everyone, and the other sources (Dena Vane) are in journals such as Marketing, many of which are offline or behind paywalls too because they are recent. I will find some more and add them. Philafrenzy (talk) 23:15, 19 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on November 11

Class of 2018

Nash Aguas and Sharlene San Pedro
Nash Aguas and Sharlene San Pedro
  • ... that the 2018 Filipino action-thriller film Class of 2018 is the first-starring role of Sharlene San Pedro and Nash Aguas (pictured), who used to do sketch comedy in the variety show Goin' Bulilit when they were little...? Source: "Former “Goin’ Bulilit” stars will reunite in the upcoming action thriller “Class of 2018." (link)
    • ALT1:... that the 2018 Filipino action-thriller film Class of 2018's director Charliebebs Gohetia chose Nash Aguas and Sharlene San Pedro (pictured) as the lead cast because he believes people want them to work together as a love team...? Source: "we decided ‘Okay let’s give it to Nash and Sharlene.’ It turns out there has been a clamor for their love team" (link)
    • ALT2:... that the 2018 Filipino action-thriller film Class of 2018 is a fulfilment of the NashLene fans' (derived from the names of the lead cast Nash Aguas and Sharlene San Pedro (pictured) wish...? Source: "The movie is kind of a dream come true for NashLene fans because they’ve been crying for the two young artists to have a love tandem on screen." (link)
    • ALT3:... that the main cast of 2018 Filipino action-thriller film Class of 2018 were the same people who used to do sketch comedy in the variety show Goin' Bulilit when they were little....? Source: same as main hook.

Created by 001Jrm (talk). Self-nominated at 08:13, 11 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Thanks for claiming, I guess. ^^ Here's my pre-comment: ALT1 and ALT2 may sound fancruft-y but I can't say the same for the main hook/ALT3. The main cast started young (like kids aged 4yrs up) and they had a show (Goin Bulilit) wherein they do comedy and sitcom. The same kids (who are now 19 yrs up) were given the lead roles for the first time and it's action-thriller (so much different from comedy). Fun fact: Usually in the Philippines, rom-com or coming-of-age genre is given for actors' first starring films (link of the actress explaining how people hope for them to do a coming-of-age film) because moviegoers tend to want to watch it more than suspense/action/thriller. That's also the reason why "love teams" are a thing in the country; thus, ALT1 and ALT2). SO I think my hooks are based on plain facts, which I just reworded to make it more interesting. Thanks! :) 001Jrm (talk) 07:30, 12 November 2018 (UTC)
Another issue is that these hooks might be interesting to a broad audience. As a Filipino myself, the hooks focusing on Goin' Bulilit (obscure outside of the country) may not work out for international tastes. I'd suggest you try proposing hooks that don't involve Goin' Bulilit or the love team. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 03:28, 14 November 2018 (UTC)
  • How 'bout...
  • ALT4:... that the 2018 Filipino action-thriller film Class of 2018's director Charliebebs Gohetia describes his film as a first in the Philippine cinema because he reinvented the genre in which he mixed multiple genres into one film?
  • ALT5:... that Nash Aguas and Sharlene San Pedro (pictured), who were given their first-starring roles in the 2018 Filipino action-thriller film Class of 2018, were initially told they were going to play the second lead characters? 001Jrm (talk) 05:09, 14 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol possible vote.svg @001Jrm: Okay, I apologize for the delay as I have been busy with real-life work. Right now, I don't think the article as it stands is ready. First of, the "Mallshows and TV guestings" section is unreferenced, and arguably is merely trivia. At best the content could instead be shortened and included in the "Marketing" section. Secondly, is there no information about how well the film did in the Philippine box office? And third and most importantly, the article is a bit hard to read, with awkward grammar and paragraph constructions. I'd suggest that the article be given a copyedit, perhaps by the people at WP:GOCE, before this can push through. For the proposed hooks, my preference is ALT5, but at more than 220 characters, it is far beyond the 200 character limit and thus has to be made more concise. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 12:05, 30 November 2018 (UTC)
I've gone ahead and made a request at WP:GOCE. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 01:56, 2 December 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on November 12

Articles created/expanded on November 14

Shukri al-Asali

Portrait of Shukri al-Asali prior to his execution in 1916
Portrait of Shukri al-Asali prior to his execution in 1916
  • Reviewed: Pending

Created by George Al-Shami (talk) and Al Ameer son (talk). Nominated by Al Ameer son (talk) at 19:38, 21 November 2018 (UTC).

Joseph Forbes (educator)

  • ... that Joseph Forbes taught boxing champion Jack Dempsey in Colorado? Source: Grandpa Was a Polygamist by Paul Bailey
    • ALT1:... that citizens of American Fork, Utah celebrated Forbes day in celebration of Joseph Forbes's 54-year teaching career? Source: Grandpa Was a Polygamist by Paul Bailey
    • ALT2:... that after Joseph Forbes was arrested for illegal cohabitation, his first wife went to live in a different state to avoid a second arrest?Source: Grandpa Was a Polygamist by Paul Bailey
  • Reviewed: Nichika_Ōmori
  • Comment: I don't have exact quotes for the hooks, but I can find them again. The page was recently nominated for speedy deletion, which I contest! Please do not review until the deletion nomination is resolved.

Created by Rachel Helps (BYU) (talk). Self-nominated at 22:23, 14 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol delete vote.svg This article has been deleted. So uncontroversial to fail and close this nomination. Joseph2302 (talk) 19:33, 15 November 2018 (UTC)
  • I believe the speedy deletion was made in error, as the page is considerably different from the first version that was deleted. Rachel Helps (BYU) (talk) 19:47, 15 November 2018 (UTC)
  • @Shirt58: where is the deletion discussion for this article, and is the newly created version sufficiently identical to the deleted version? Rachel Helps (BYU), if Shirt58 does not respond, consider taking this to WP:DRV. feminist (talk) 03:31, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol possible vote.svg Marking as "maybe" as the article creator is an experienced editor and the ineligibility of the nomination has been contested. feminist (talk) 03:33, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
@Rachel Helps (BYU) and Feminist: The WP:AFD was Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Joseph Barlow Forbes. As always, please let me know if I can help in any way. Pete AU aka Shirt58 (talk) 10:39, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
Thank you. If there is non-trivial difference between the version created by Rachel Helps (BYU) and the deleted version, the G4 deletion may be inappropriate (but as a non-admin, I can't judge). There are two possible approaches: the first is to restore the G4-deleted article to draft space, then take this to WP:DRV; the second is to restore the article in mainspace then immediately take it to WP:AFD. feminist (talk) 10:55, 17 November 2018 (UTC)
@Shirt58: is the G4-deleted version of Joseph Forbes (educator) substantially similar in content to Joseph Barlow Forbes? If not, would you mind undeleting it and placing it in draft space? c (talk) 10:26, 18 November 2018 (UTC)
Yes, my argument is that the page did not qualify for speedy deletion, as the most recently deleted version was substantially different from the one covered under the original deletion discussion. I added several sources which I believe fulfill Wikipedia's notability guidelines. Rachel Helps (BYU) (talk) 16:11, 20 November 2018 (UTC)

─────────────────────────Hello @Rachel Helps (BYU) and Feminist:, Simething odd is going on wirh ny computer keyboard, I;ll need to sort that out. In the mean time,

deleted versions

My apologies fo the delay. Pete AU aka Shirt58 (talk) 09:15, 21 November 2018 (UTC)

Thanks. Based on the restored versions I'd say the G4 deletion was inappropriate. However, I agree that this is borderline for notability. Most of the coverage was from two books written by the subject's grandson. Rachel Helps (BYU), consider taking this to WP:DRV if you want this to be kept. feminist (talk) 11:04, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
I dunno about that. Shirt58 brought this to my attention as the closer of the AfD, and after looking at both versions, I don't think it really passes G4. It clearly started as an exact copy, and the meat of the new changes occurred over these diffs. I went through the new draft and removed all the sentences that were exact copies from the original, and that's mostly it. In my view, it's not enough to make it substantially different, especially when looking at the AfD. The new version clearly introduces new sources, which is enough to at least consider whether it should be overturned given the concerns at AfD, but I don't think the new sources or content push up against the notability issues. At any rate, I agree with Feminist that WP:DRV is the perfect venue for this if you want to contest the G4 Rachel Helps (BYU). ~ Amory (utc) 16:17, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
@Amorymeltzer: Looking at this article's history again, what's interesting is that this was restored as a draft after AfD, expanded somewhat, accepted (by a blocked editor) at AfC, then speedy deleted. The best an admin could have done in this situation would have been to move this back to draft space and refer the article expander to DRV. This article should not have been mainspaced without a DRV discussion, unless GNG is so obvious as to not require discussion (which is the case with e.g. the Incel article, but not here). feminist (talk) 16:35, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
Thank you for your comments. I've created a deletion review (DRV) for the page, so feel free to comment there. I will comment here after the DRV. Rachel Helps (BYU) (talk) 17:20, 26 November 2018 (UTC)
The speedy deletion was overturned, but it's possible there could be another nomination for deletion in the future. Rachel Helps (BYU) (talk) 19:10, 5 December 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on November 15

Articles created/expanded on November 16

Dendrobium cucumerinum

in cultivation
in cultivation
  • Reviewed: TBA

5x expanded by Gderrin (talk) and Casliber (talk). Nominated by Casliber (talk) at 13:42, 22 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg - Length, Date (Dendrobium bowmanii is slightly late but Dendrobium cucumerinum is well within timing, I'm not particularly concerned with the slight delay), Cite, and Earwigs check. Image is freely licensed with permission on file in OTRS. Cas, if you are able to do two QPQs (one for each article), this should be good to go. Best, Mifter (talk) 01:28, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

Selfish genetic element

5x expanded by Arvidagren (talk). Self-nominated at 18:54, 16 November 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on November 17

Geology of Hong Kong

Geological map of Hong Kong. Green is volcanic rocks, red is granitic rocks.
Geological map of Hong Kong. Green is volcanic rocks, red is granitic rocks.

5x expanded by HarrietHKUGeology (talk). Nominated by Graeme Bartlett (talk) at 21:32, 19 November 2018 (UTC).

Policy compliance:

Hook eligiblity:

  • Cited: Red XN - No inline citation
  • Interesting: Green tickY

Image eligibility:

QPQ: None required.

Overall: Symbol question.svg This article needs major work before it's ready for DYK. SounderBruce 05:34, 24 November 2018 (UTC)

  • Symbol delete vote.svg I'm marking this for closure. This was completed as an assignment and the creator hasn't edited since November 22. The nominator has been editing, but they have not returned to this nomination. SL93 (talk) 22:47, 9 December 2018 (UTC)
  • @Graeme Bartlett: Are you still willing to continue this nomination? Courtesy ping to Jo-Jo Eumerus as they have an editing interest in volcanoes. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 03:47, 10 December 2018 (UTC)
    Sorry, but right now I have little interest in Hong Kong volcanoes. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 15:25, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

Archean felsic volcanic rocks

Archean felsic volcanic rock containing fiamme structure
Archean felsic volcanic rock containing fiamme structure

Moved to mainspace by Ivancyyip (talk). Nominated by Graeme Bartlett (talk) at 04:50, 19 November 2018 (UTC).

Hydrothermal mineral deposit

  • Reviewed: Khukri Rum
  • Comment: Part of Regional Geology course at HKU

Created by Alexgiovi (talk). Nominated by Graeme Bartlett (talk) at 22:55, 19 November 2018 (UTC).

Policy compliance:

QPQ: Done.

Overall: Symbol possible vote.svg Article needs better sourcing overall GiantSnowman 17:00, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

Northeast Syrtis

Created by Justinbl (talk). Nominated by Graeme Bartlett (talk) at 23:09, 19 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg The page was moved to the mainspace, rather than created, on 17 November 2018, so it still qualifies. While it is definitely lengthy, I'd have to quote Neil Armstrong from Gemini 8 and say that we've got serious problems here. First of all, there's no source in your nomination to support the hook, which is already outdated since Jezero crater was chosen as the landing site of the Mars 2020 rover on Tuesday. In fact, you've left the default message up there, which is quite funny. The article itself leaves a vast amount of content uncited, too. An entire paragraph under the "Mesa unit" subheading lacks even a single citation, for example. Over a third of the citations that do exist in the article are missing |date= values. Outside of the DYK criteria I also want to personally note that the orphan issue needs to be fixed, along with the strange use of images, which are incredibly oversized and overpopulate the article, along with the many typos and incorrect spelling of words. It is my understanding that the article's original writer may not have English as a native and/or fluent language, and the article may need some editorial oversight. – PhilipTerryGraham (talk · articles · reviews) 13:45, 22 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Working on this. It is now copyedited, and deorphaned. I have now changed the hook, as you are right, it was out of date already. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 07:07, 24 November 2018 (UTC)
  • Now each paragraph has a cite at least and date errors fixed, and shrunk the pics. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 02:38, 27 November 2018 (UTC)

Regolith-hosted rare earth element deposits

A regolith-hosted rare earth element deposit mine in South China
A regolith-hosted rare earth element deposit mine in South China

Created/expanded by Kevnmh (talk). Nominated by Graeme Bartlett (talk) at 23:48, 19 November 2018 (UTC).

Salt deformation

Rock salt in blue deforms and flows upwards under pressure.
Rock salt in blue deforms and flows upwards under pressure.
  • Reviewed: Green's law
  • Comment: part of Regional geology class at HKU

Moved to mainspace by Myip003 (talk). Nominated by Graeme Bartlett (talk) at 23:58, 19 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg @Myip003 and Graeme Bartlett: Very thorough work! There are a few issues to work out but they are minor. I'd say this is very close to Good Article status if these issues are dealt with, and I'd encourage a nomination for that status.
    • New and long enough, Earwig detects no copyvios, QPQ done. I changed the wikilinks in the hook to emphasize the article is specifically about the deformation. Good job on the original images!
    • A couple of paragraphs lack citations, and a lot don't have citations at the very end of the paragraph, making it unclear what the final sentence(s) are cited to.
    • Orphan banner needs to be dealt with.
    • I doubt that caption of the lead image is accurate: pure rock salt would be colorless, and the original caption (on the Flickr page) does not claim that this is a pure sample.
    • It looks like there are a lot of primary research articles used as sources; it is generally better to rely on review articles but this is beyond the scope of a DYK review so it's okay for now.
Antony–22 (talkcontribs) 04:32, 28 November 2018 (UTC)


Tsawela tonalitic gneiss from South Africa
Tsawela tonalitic gneiss from South Africa
  • Reviewed: Erwin Wickert
  • Comment: Part of Regional Geology class at HKU

5x expanded by Adayding (talk). Nominated by Graeme Bartlett (talk) at 00:18, 20 November 2018 (UTC).

Oei Tjie Sien

Created by ClaraElisaOng (talk). Nominated by ClaraElisaOng (talk) at 06:42, 17 November 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on November 18

Goldberg Variations (play)

George Tabori in the 1980s
George Tabori in the 1980s
  • ... that George Tabori (pictured) directed the premiere of his play Die Goldberg-Variationen in Vienna in 1991, presenting biblical conflicts between Mr. Jay and Goldberg as a surrealistic farce? Source: several

Created by Ipigott (talk) and Gerda Arendt (talk). Nominated by Gerda Arendt (talk) at 13:20, 25 November 2018 (UTC).

  • General eligiblity:
  • New Enough: Green tickY
  • Long Enough: Green tickY
  • Other problems: Red XN - The hook fact (about biblical conflicts being presented as "surrealist") is not mentioned in the article; indeed, the phrase used in the article is "a satirical combination of seriousness and farce"

Policy compliance:

Hook eligiblity:

  • Cited: Green tickY
  • Interesting: Green tickY
  • Other problems: Green tickY
QPQ: Done.

Overall: Symbol question.svg AGF for German-language sources. The contradiction between the hook and the article needs to be resolved before I approve this. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 03:51, 29 November 2018 (UTC)

I'd love to use the wording from the article but it's too long. The exact quote from the cited book [22] is also too long: "... a montage of jokes, surrealistic comedy, farce and obscene slapstick humor", so I thought "surrealistic farce" was a valid short version. Do you think the quote needs to be in the article? Seems a bit undue weight to me. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:13, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
If it's a quote about reception or discussing the play's themes, all the more should the quote be in the article. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 23:07, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
To make the hook tighter, how about this wording?
ALT1:... that George Tabori's (pictured) play Die Goldberg-Variationen presents biblical conflicts between the characters Mr. Jay and Goldberg as "a satirical combination of seriousness and farce"?
Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 23:09, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
Thank you for the suggestion, on which we can build. I don't like beginning with a possessive, then pictured, and finally the link we want readers to click. While that is just beauty, the phrase "biblical conflicts between the characters Mr. Jay and Goldberg" is so wrong that I wonder what we did wrong in the article. The biblical conflicts are staged by the character, a director and his assistant, and there are conflicts on other levels than the biblical plot of the play in the play. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:40, 30 November 2018 (UTC)
ps: Also, I miss Tabori as the director of the premiere. A director staging (himself?) a God-like creator ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:42, 30 November 2018 (UTC)
Do you have an alternate wording in mind? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 10:52, 30 November 2018 (UTC)
No. At the airplane, flight called. Feel free. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:03, 30 November 2018 (UTC)
  • @Gerda Arendt: It's been two weeks. Please propose a new hook as I'm afraid the currently proposed hook is undesirable. I very much like the hook facts presented, it just needs to be reworded in a more concise way (meaning, direct to the point), while also not contradicting the article text. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:12, 10 December 2018 (UTC)
I was waiting for you, because - see above - I said I had no alternative in mind. This is quite low on my priority scale, getting close to Christmas, it's not a topic I'm familiar with, and I am no wordsmith in English. Dr. Blofeld? Ipigott? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:49, 10 December 2018 (UTC)
ALT2: ... that in Die Goldberg-Variationen, a satirical play by George Tabori who staged the premiere in Vienna in 1991, biblical scenes are staged by Mr. Jay and Goldberg with conflicts on many levels?
ALT3: ... that in George Tabori's play Die Goldberg-Variationen, biblical scenes are satirically presented as a series of disasters?--Ipigott (talk) 08:27, 10 December 2018 (UTC)
I kind of like ALT3, but the hook fact isn't mentioned in the plot section. Granted this is not exactly a problem, except that it makes the plot section look really short by comparison. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 10:06, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on November 19

Bieling Architekten

Headquarter of Basler Versicherungen
Headquarter of Basler Versicherungen
  • ... that Bieling Architekten was founded in 1955 by Josef Bieling who mainly designed churches, while his two sons focus on headquarters (example pictured) and city quarters? Source: several

Created by Gerda Arendt (talk). Self-nominated at 14:32, 26 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg Can a new hook be proposed here? It's not really unusual for architects to work on different kinds of structures. Also, who is supposed to be the subject of this hook: Bieling or his sons? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 03:57, 10 December 2018 (UTC)
Both, like the article, therefore it seems worth mentioning (to me) that one focused on this, his sons on something else. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:41, 10 December 2018 (UTC)
Honestly I don't like the current hook: it's confusing to readers and is not really that interesting. Can we try something else here? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 09:46, 10 December 2018 (UTC)
How about reviewing things where you like the hook? I also don't think that a reviewer's likes and dislikes should play a role. I tried to give justice to the two generations mentioned. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:52, 10 December 2018 (UTC)
ALT1: ... that in two generations of Bieling architects, founder Josef Bieling mainly designed churches, while his two sons have shaped city quarters? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:52, 10 December 2018 (UTC)


  • ... that deschooling was coined by Ivan Illich, who believed that traditional education received by children needed to be reconstructed?? Deschooling Society by Ivan Illich
    • ALT1:... that ...? Source: "You are strongly encouraged to quote the source text supporting each hook" (and [link] the source, or cite it briefly without using citation templates)

5x expanded by MadisonLiggio (talk) and EmilycHingle (talk). Nominated by MadisonLiggio (talk) at 04:23, 19 November 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on November 20

Raymond Arritt

Raymond Arritt in 2017
Raymond Arritt in 2017

Created by IntoThinAir (talk). Nominated by Flibirigit (talk) at 14:38, 26 November 2018 (UTC).

@EdChem and Gerda Arendt:, please feel free to make additional suggestions. I have added both of you with a nomination credit, and donated a QPQ. Flibirigit (talk) 14:52, 26 November 2018 (UTC)

ALT2: ... that when the 2007 Nobel Peace Prize went to the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, researcher Raymond Arritt said "It's kind of neat: I have, like, .002 percent of a Nobel prize now"? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:55, 26 November 2018 (UTC)
@IntoThinAir: Thanks for creating this and adding the QPQ. Much appreciated. My suggestions on a hook are:
It would be good if we could add a "(pictured)" too, if we can get a suitable picture from his son. EdChem (talk) 06:20, 27 November 2018 (UTC)
"Wikipedian" is not in the article, hard to sourced, and I'd not even wanted it to be mentioned in the hook, even IF in the article. An image would be great. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:47, 27 November 2018 (UTC)
I agree with Gerda, we cannot use a hook with Wikipedian at this time as it is not sourced nor in the article. If that changes, we can reconsider. A photo would be nice if released by the owner, since it is still too early to claim fair use with a Template:Non-free biog-pic license. Flibirigit (talk) 13:55, 27 November 2018 (UTC)
Photo had been added to the nomination, and User:Sarritt added it to the aticle. Flibirigit (talk) 00:25, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
  • I agree that we can't say "Wikipedian" without that being in the article. However, I think it would be nice to be able to say it as part of showing who Raymond was, and also to note (in passing) that Wikipedians include some amazing people.
  • I thank Flibirigit for starting the nomination and apologise for my unclear acknowledgement above – I meant to recognise IntoThinAir for starting the article and Flibirigit for the DYK nomination and I garbled it. :(
  • Thank you to Sarritt, Raymond's son, for providing the photograph and to Flibirigit for adding it into the nomination.
  • I have concerns about the original hook and ALT1 as Raymond did not share the Nobel Prize. It was shared between the IPCC and Al Gore. The IPCC itself explicitly stated that:

The prize was awarded to the IPCC as an organization, and not to any individual associated with the IPCC. Thus it is incorrect to refer to any IPCC official, or scientist who worked on IPCC reports, as a Nobel laureate or Nobel Prize winner. It would be correct to describe a scientist who was involved with AR4 or earlier IPCC reports in this way: “X contributed to the reports of the IPCC, which was awarded the Nobel Peace Prize in 2007.”

Further, the personalised certificates that the IPCC leadership presented related to the Nobel Prize were not sent to contributing authors (which is what Raymond was, as I understand it). Regarding the original hook, I'm not sure his research was for the IPCC, either. Consequently, I believe that we should strike the original hook and ALT1, and choose from ALT2 or ALT3a/b (without the mention of Wikipedian if necessary).
  • ALT2 has the phrase "Nobel Prize" twice, which I have avoided in ALT3a/b by adding the wikilink into the quote itself, in two different possible ways – these are also more concise. So, as far as I can see, here's where we are... EdChem (talk) 01:16, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
Prof. Arritt in 2017
Prof. Arritt in 2017
We may just be having the longest discussion on hooks, before the nomination has actually been reviewed by a neutral party. I will revisit this hopefully on the weekend or by Monday. I will be fairly busy until then. Flibirigit (talk) 01:47, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
P.S. I have added a writing credit to Softlavender for her work. Flibirigit (talk) 03:06, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
I don't think the duplication of Nobel Prize is a problem: we can't link from the quote, and can't change the quote. We normally don't say "Prof.", why should we here? We have space to have the full title of the panel instead of an abbreviation, mentioning Climate Change! --Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:22, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
Symbol redirect vote 4.svg I see a lot of good suggestions have been made, and I'm indifferent as to which is used. Since a lot of comments have been made so far, it almost looks like a review has been done, when one hasn't. I am putting a red chaeck mark here to make it clear that a review is needed. Flibirigit (talk) 15:07, 3 December 2018 (UTC)

Herbert Vivian

Created by Railfan23 (talk). Self-nominated at 08:08, 22 November 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on November 21

The Baker Street Journal

Created/expanded by ThaddeusSholto (talk). Self-nominated at 02:14, 27 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg There are two glaring issues at the moment. First, the article is only 1204 characters, which is short of the 1500 requirement. Secondly, the article currently has a stub template. Otherwise, the article seems to meet other requirements: it is new enough, the sourcing is adequate; offline sources are accepted in good faith. The article is stable, neutral, and free from close paraphrasing. This is the nominator's fourth DYK nomination so no QPQ is required. The article needs more work before this can be approved; this will pass once the necessary expansion is done. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 03:57, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
How do I check the character number of an article? ThaddeusSholto (talk) 14:31, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
@ThaddeusSholto: You can try using Shubinator's DYK check tool: the link and instructions are at User:Shubinator/DYKcheck. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 14:57, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
OK thank you. ThaddeusSholto (talk) 14:47, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

NMS Regina Maria

Regina Maria off Sevastopol, 1944
Regina Maria off Sevastopol, 1944

Improved to Good Article status by Sturmvogel 66 (talk). Nominated by L293D (talk) at 14:21, 26 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol voting keep.svg
QPQ: Done.

Overall: Symbol redirect vote 4.svg Hook meets requirements but could maybe be a bit shorter and punchier? Perhaps something like ALT1 ... that the Soviet Union seized the Romanian destroyer Regina Maria and commissioned it into their navy despite Romania having switched sides to join the Allies? This is my first DYK review, and I have suggested an alternate hook, so I would appreciate a second review. Glorioussandwich (talk) 18:05, 27 November 2018 (UTC)

  • Nice suggestion, I've added it as ALT1 and struck the original hook. L293D ( • ) 14:23, 29 November 2018 (UTC)

Russell Crowe's jockstrap

Created by Anna Frodesiak (talk) and SoWhy (talk). Nominated by SoWhy (talk) at 20:28, 25 November 2018 (UTC).

  • I believe the AfD closer suggested on the TP that the article be moved to another name while it still isn't clear who actually owns the thing. I suppose that should delay the promotion, no? A snarky suggestion would be to add "and got publicity for their show on the Wikipedia front page for free". I'm sure that's not the intention, mind you. Maybe:
ALT2: John Oliver got his name on a koala chlamydia ward in Australia by buying a jockstrap? — 🍣 SashiRolls t · c 13:20, 2 December 2018 (UTC)
A pending rename does not make a DYK nom ineligible. The link can always be repaired later. As for alternatives, I'd prefer: ALT3: ... that the money from the sale of Russell Crowe's jockstrap allowed the Australia Zoo to establish a koala chlamydia ward?
I'll get on the QPQ asap. Regards SoWhy 14:07, 3 December 2018 (UTC)

Lackawanna Limited wreck

  • ... that the Lackawanna Limited was traveling about 80 miles per hour (130 km/h) when it struck a freight train and derailed in 1943, killing 29 people? Source: "[23] (29 deaths), "The authorized speed for No. 3 in this locality is 80 m.p.h., and the train was moving at about that speed when it passed the last automatic signal, 3,200 ft. east of the point of the accident." from the ICC report)
    • ALT1:... that an airplane carrying an emergency shipment of blood plasma for victims of the Lackawanna Limited landed on a runway illuminated by automobile headlights? Source:([24])
    • ALT2:... that during rescue operations after the wreck of the Lackawanna Limited, a wartime blackout was ignored? Source: " Working with the aid of hastily erected spotlights and the glare from automobile headlights" [25]

Created by MB (talk). Self-nominated at 04:19, 23 November 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on November 22

Alabama v. North Carolina

Moved to mainspace by DannyS712 (talk). Self-nominated at 23:20, 22 November 2018 (UTC).

Go Mishima

Created by Morgan695 (talk). Self-nominated at 05:05, 22 November 2018 (UTC).

QPQ: Done.

Overall: Symbol redirect vote 4.svg I am a new reviewed DannyS712 (talk) 18:52, 29 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on November 23

The Aboriginal Mother

  • Reviewed: Ma'adin Ijafen
  • Comment: While I believe this topic as a whole is interesting, I'm having a hard time coming out with a good hook for DYK. It may be better to combine some of these or condense them in some way.

5x expanded by SkyGazer 512 (talk). Self-nominated at 14:06, 30 November 2018 (UTC).

Al-Barakah (ISIL administrative division)

Created by Applodion (talk). Self-nominated at 12:55, 30 November 2018 (UTC).

Cyberwar: How Russian Hackers and Trolls Helped Elect a President

Jamieson in 2011
Jamieson in 2011

Created by SusanLesch (talk). Self-nominated at 19:44, 28 November 2018 (UTC).

Matthew Hedges

  • Reviewed: Wayne Matthews
  • Comment: Ongoing event, so hook may need to change to stay correct/up-to-date, or better hooks may emerge

Created by Joseph2302 (talk). Self-nominated at 09:38, 24 November 2018 (UTC).

Robert Seyfarth (scientist), Dorothy Cheney (scientist)

Female Chacma baboon with infant (Botswana)
Female Chacma baboon with infant (Botswana)
  • ... that ...according to primatologists Robert Seyfarth and Dorothy Cheney successful baboons use Jane Austen strategies: "be nice to your relatives and get in with the high-ranking relatives"? Source: University of Delaware Newsletter, 2009.
  • Reviewed: Dipolydora commensalis and Neanthes fucata (1 DYK for 2 articles)
  • Comment: Seyfarth and Cheney were married, lifelong collaborators and distinguished scientists. Cheney (who has had an article since May) recently died, so it would be nice to include her article in the DYK for Seyfarth's, if that is OK.

Created/expanded by HouseOfChange (talk) and Jlviegas (talk) (creator of article about Dorothy Cheney). Nominated by HouseOfChange (talk) at 22:30, 23 November 2018 (UTC).


  • ... that Chief Minister Zeik-Bye of Hanthawaddy persuaded Prince Binnya Nwe to revolt by saying that his mother Princess Maha Dewi was planning to put her lover on the throne? Source: (Pan Hla 2005: 81–83) and (Fernquest 2006: 5)[26]

Created by Hybernator (talk). Self-nominated at 06:01, 27 November 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on November 24

Eugène de Mirecourt

Eugène de Mirecourt
Eugène de Mirecourt

Created by LouisAlain (talk) and Gerda Arendt (talk). Nominated by Gerda Arendt (talk) at 23:34, 1 December 2018 (UTC).

Neacomys minutus, Neacomys spinosus

5x expanded by Cwmhiraeth (talk). Self-nominated at 07:37, 1 December 2018 (UTC).


PSLV C-42 rocket.
PSLV C-42 rocket.
  • ... that PSLV-C42 (pictured) was used in the Core Alone configuration without the six strap-on motors, that is, the lightest version of the PSLV rocket, for the launch of two British earth observation satellites? [27]: "PSLV-C42 mission in its Core Alone configuration, is scheduled to launch two satellites S1-4 and NovaSAR from United Kingdom. In this configuration, the rocket will be without six solid strap-on motors. This version was first flown in April 2007 and is the lightest version of PSLV.
    • ALT1:... that ...PSLV-C42 (pictured) was the first fully commercial launch of the PSLV rocket in 2018 following a five-month long hiatus since its last launch on 12 April 2018? [28]: "PSLV-C42 will be the first fully commercial trip of the year, breaking a five-month-long lull, for the Indian Space Research Organisation (ISRO).

Improved to Good Article status by MBlaze Lightning (talk). Self-nominated at 06:24, 30 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg Both hooks have been struck for being unsuitable: ALT0 for being too clunky, and ALT1 for being uninteresting (it's not unusual for rockets to go years between launches: notably the Space Shuttle twice went over a year without being launched, following vehicle losses; a five-month hiatus is a drop in the bucket comparatively speaking). Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 04:00, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

Stephen L. Dubuisson

Photograph of Stephen Larigaudelle Dubuisson
Photograph of Stephen Larigaudelle Dubuisson

Created by Ergo Sum (talk). Self-nominated at 18:37, 27 November 2018 (UTC).

A. Wilson Greene

Historian A. Wilson Greene
Historian A. Wilson Greene

Source: An 8 March 2012 article in Milwaukee’s Civil War Round Table General Orders says: "In 1995, he [Greene] became the first director at Pamplin Historical Park and the National Museum of the Civil War Soldier…"

Created by Orygun (talk). Self-nominated at 05:04, 24 November 2018 (UTC).

Preta Fernanda

Preta Fernanda's 1912 memoir
Preta Fernanda's 1912 memoir
  • ... that Preta Fernanda's Lisbon brothel was a meeting place for writers, politicians and bohemians ...? Source: "she opened a social hall in Bairro Alto, which was inaugurated with "a lot of lust." It was one of the nightly meeting places for writers, politicians and tourists, in the bohemian Lisbon of the late nineteenth and early twentieth centuries." (translated)
    • ALT1:... that, scandalously, Preta Fernanda was the only woman who remained in the room when Almada Negreiros presented Ultimatum Futurista in 1917 ...? Source: "She lived in several streets of Bairro Alto and is said to have been the only woman who did not leave the room when Almada Negreiros read Ultimatum Futurista in 1917."(translated)

Moved to mainspace by Pburka (talk). Self-nominated at 01:39, 24 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg Neither hook is interesting to a broad audience and thus have been struck. @Pburka: please propose new hooks. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 04:00, 29 November 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on November 25

Giovanni Cosimo Bonomo

  • Created by Wuerzele (talk). Self-nominated at 17:45, 29 November 2018 (UTC).
Symbol possible vote.svg @Wuerzele: The hook as it stands is too long and too confusing, trying to put too much information. Can you make this shorter and focus on only one aspect? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 23:45, 2 December 2018 (UTC)
t thanks for the comment. I am painfully aware, but have been unable to decide what is most interesting. One of the reasons we have DYK review is that other editors opinions help create a good DYK! So go for it, please! Wuerzele (talk) 09:05, 7 December 2018 (UTC)
What about merely focusing on discovering itch mite as a cause of scabies? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:54, 9 December 2018 (UTC)

Bridgend Farmhouse Community Project

Moved to mainspace by Iainmacintyre (talk). Self-nominated at 17:34, 28 November 2018 (UTC).

  • .

Acanthosquilla derijardi

  • Reviewed: tbd
  • Comment: A. sirindhorn is available (it is a scientific name which was published in accordance with the ICZN Code), but invalid (it's not the name currently used for the species) due to subsequent synonymization. Not sure if that means ALT1 is out or not, though.

Created by Umimmak (talk). Self-nominated at 01:55, 28 November 2018 (UTC).

Dean Thompson

Created by Raintheone (talk). Self-nominated at 22:29, 26 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg @Raintheone: I'm not confident with either hook: the first hook might be of interest to fans of the series but not so much to the average person, while the second hook is commonplace (it's very common for actors to seek advice from peers when preparing for roles). Can something better be proposed here? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 04:02, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
@Narutolovehinata5: - Thank you for the review. We have discussed hooks before. Can you think of a different hook better suited to our broad audience? I recall you did better than I at creating a replacement on a previous DYKN.Rain the 1 15:36, 4 December 2018 (UTC)
I'm afraid I wouldn't be able to help out this time much, sorry. I would have tried proposing a suggestion here, but some of the sources in the article are paywalled and I can't access them. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 11:46, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
@Narutolovehinata5:In which case would you consider striking your comments and letting someone else review this DYK? Perhaps other editors have access to the paywall sources.Rain the 1 22:08, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

Rosalie Housman

Created by SL93 (talk). Self-nominated at 15:31, 25 November 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg Honestly the hook isn't very good: from what I can tell from Jacobs-Bond's article, she appeared to have been a composer of some repute. However, the hook as it stands doesn't work as it lacks context on Jacobs-Bond's importance: i.e., how is being praised by her a big deal? As such, I'm afraid that I'll have to strike the hook. I would also suggest expanding the article further, as there doesn't seem to be much else content that could work as hooks, other than perhaps those review quotes. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 04:06, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
  • I will find a different hook, but I won't expand the article because I can't expand the article. She is notable, but there isn't much more out there. It is DYK length so I know it isn't a problem. SL93 (talk) 04:12, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
  • I unstriked the hook. You are free to bring it up for further discussion on the DYK talk page. SL93 (talk) 04:14, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
Please don't unstrike the hook, it has been struck for a reason. Theoretically, a variation of it might work (i.e. a version that explains Jacobs-Bond's importance), but the hook as currently proposed is unsuitable. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 04:16, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
Consensus works both ways in my view. Maybe I'm being too upset, but I just had an editor add unreliable content to the Kate McComb article, that was already approved for DYK, and then they had the audacity to tell me to source the unreliable content that they added. SL93 (talk) 04:19, 29 November 2018 (UTC)

I will withdraw this. I don't like that one editor can strike down a hook and I certainly don't like what Yoninah did on the Kate McComb article. SL93 (talk) 04:36, 29 November 2018 (UTC)

@SL93: Are you sure about this? You don't have any other suggestions here? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 04:53, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
ALT1... that Rosalie Housman's compositions were praised by Carrie Jacobs-Bond, a composer who performed for Theodore Roosevelt at the White House? SL93 (talk) 05:05, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
I also added it to the article. SL93 (talk) 05:05, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
I forgot the ping - Narutolovehinata5. SL93 (talk) 07:38, 29 November 2018 (UTC)
There are plenty of facts I could replace that with when it comes to why being praised by her was significant - such as Carrie Jacobs-Bond being the first woman to open her own publishing firm and the first woman to sell over a million copies of her sheet music. SL93 (talk) 04:35, 3 December 2018 (UTC)
  • ALT2: ... that Rosalie Housman's compositions were sung by prominent musicians of the time? SL93 (talk) 04:42, 3 December 2018 (UTC)
  • Symbol redirect vote 4.svg I potentially need a new reviewer. SL93 (talk) 01:26, 4 December 2018 (UTC)
Being the first woman to sell over a million copies of her sheet music might make for an interesting hook. Please suggest a hook based on that and I'll take a look. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 16:28, 4 December 2018 (UTC)
Narutolovehinata5 ALT3: ... that Rosalie Housman's compositions were praised by Carrie Jacobs-Bond, a composer who was the first woman to sell over a million copies of her sheet music?
ALT4: ... that Rosalie Housman's compositions were sung by prominent musicians of the time including Florence Easton and Sara Teasdale? SL93 (talk) 16:37, 4 December 2018 (UTC)
I guess my preference here would be ALT4. Those names aren't really familiar to a broad audience, but I suppose the context would make it interesting. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 23:42, 4 December 2018 (UTC)
Thank you. Though I think it's more broad of an audience than many hooks that I see go through. SL93 (talk) 00:00, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
I crossed out the first three alt hooks, but I'm not sure if this is an approval of alt4. SL93 (talk) 00:05, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
Without the tick I mean. SL93 (talk) 01:38, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
It's not an approval but more of a suggestion. I'm not really ready to approve the hook as I'd like to hear a second opinion on it first from other editors: @Gerda Arendt and Yoninah: thoughts on ALT4? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 14:09, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
ALT4 is fine, however, I have a problem with the article, hopefully nothing to upset you further, SL93. I have no idea what kind of music she composed, and how it sounds. Is it songs, and only songs (art songs, with piano?), that should be said. Do we have any titles, lyricists? - Minor: first she studies, then she lectures, than come her teachers, - I'd put that in chronology. How do you feel about an infobox. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:20, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
The book that I used for the article says that she did songs for the violin and piano. It also has a list of some of her work for chamber, piano, vocal, and sacred. I will add it now. I can also add an infobox. SL93 (talk) 14:27, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
Gerda Arendt I tried to address your concerns. What do you think? SL93 (talk) 14:52, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
Much better, thank you! - I'd write a hook around the Pieces of Jade, mentioning the interesting scoring, seriously. How about saying "mostly songs and chamber music" in the lead? I don't understand the first two lines under compositions, would perhaps make it prose, and move the details about some songs also under that header. Perhaps all prose? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:10, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
ALT5: ... that Rosalie Housman's composition was made for made for violin, viola, flute, gong, harp and soprano? I don't know as much about music as you do, but it does seems unusual to me to have a gong included in there. I made more changes to the article. SL93 (talk) 15:26, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
Thank you! I prefer active voice, so would say:
ALT6: ... that Rosalie Housman composed Pieces of Jade for violin, viola, flute, gong, harp and soprano?
Do we know when, or about when? Because this could have been last year ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:18, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
A source that I have just says 1938? for the date. SL93 (talk) 17:19, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
So we could add "c. 1938" or begin "In the 1930s" or leave it as it is. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 17:26, 5 December 2018 (UTC)

Symbol redirect vote 4.svg Gerda Arendt's hook just needs an approval. SL93 (talk) 21:04, 9 December 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on November 26

Intergroup relations

5x expanded by Peter.h.fisher (talk). Self-nominated at 06:43, 3 December 2018 (UTC).

Social emotional development

  • Comment: moved the the article space November 26, 2018

Created by Christine Moody cmoody404 (talk). Nominated by Cmoody404 (talk) at 23:49, 2 December 2018 (UTC).

  • Hey Cmoody404. I'll pick this one up. Gimme a few days to look the article over. GMGtalk 18:46, 6 December 2018 (UTC)
  • Copyvio looks good. New enough. Definitely long enough. GMGtalk 21:16, 6 December 2018 (UTC)

Bernard A. Maguire

Bernard Maguire in 1866
Bernard Maguire in 1866

Created by Ergo Sum (talk). Self-nominated at 06:37, 2 December 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg Can a new hook be proposed here? It doesn't seem very interesting, and it's also very vague (separating the preparatory division of what? The University?). Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 04:03, 10 December 2018 (UTC)
    • @Narutolovehinata5: That's the main thing he's known for as far as his presidency of Georgetown is concerned; it was a fairly significant decision. I've added a alternate hook, though, that might be catchier. Ergo Sum 05:10, 10 December 2018 (UTC)
      • Unfortunately that's still not a very interesting hook fact. Separating divisions isn't exactly uncommon in the academic world. Something else here needs to be proposed. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 09:46, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on November 27

Alexina Maude Wildman

Created by SkyGazer 512 (talk). Self-nominated at 17:17, 2 December 2018 (UTC).

  • The full review will be to follow, but my preference would be the original hook. Though I think it might be a bit too long and thus would need to be shortened somewhat. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 01:13, 3 December 2018 (UTC)
  • @Narutolovehinata5: I like original hook as well and I do agree that it needs to be shortened. I'm not able to think of many good ways to do so without removing key information, however. Do you have any specific suggestions? I do think we could probably change the first part of the sentence to something like "that Alexina Maude Wildman wrote one of the most widely read columns in The Bulletin at the time," which would shorten it a bit.--SkyGazer 512 Oh no, what did I do this time? 02:13, 3 December 2018 (UTC)
What about something like "that Alexina Maude Wildman wrote one of the most widely read columns in The Bulletin, despite editor and co-owner J. F. Archibald's belief that women could not write poetry?" Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 03:07, 3 December 2018 (UTC)
Looks good; added as ALT4 (ALT3, see below). Thanks! With the exception of ALT1, which I don't really like that much, I personally am neutral about the hooks; ALT2 and ALT3 (ALT2) seem(s) sort of quirky and unique, but I do think the part about Archibald's belief that women could not write poetry in ALT4 (ALT3) is nice as well. I'd be fine with whatever the reviewer thinks is best.--SkyGazer 512 Oh no, what did I do this time? 04:36, 3 December 2018 (UTC)
Actually, it seems that I misread the part about the Philip May cartoon. I've removed the hook now and modified the ALT# of the others accordingly. Thanks to Krelnik for pointing that out; it makes a lot more sense that way!--SkyGazer 512 Oh no, what did I do this time? 13:32, 3 December 2018 (UTC)
@Narutolovehinata5: Are you still planning on doing a full review? Either way's fine, it would just be nice to know.--SkyGazer 512 Oh no, what did I do this time? 16:51, 9 December 2018 (UTC)
Actually I am. I apologize for the delay, I've just been busy with other things. Just give me a moment. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:04, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

────────────────────── That's fine, there's no rush.--SkyGazer 512 Oh no, what did I do this time? 00:08, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

Hook eligiblity:

  • Cited: Red XN - The hook fact for ALT4 doesn't have the in-line citation, and the hook is slightly inaccurate: the hook affirms that it was one of the most widely-read columns, but the article states that it was likely to be such.
  • Interesting: Green tickY
  • Other problems: Green tickY
QPQ: Done.

Overall: Symbol question.svg My preference is ALT4, but as I more-or-less proposed it, I'll leave the final approval to another editor. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 04:09, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

@Narutolovehinata5: Added the extra inline cite; the same ref is already cited 3 times in the paragraph, including shortly after the sentence, but I suppose it's better to have too much verification than too less for DYK hooks. I've modified the hooks (ALT0 and ALT3, that is) a bit to better match what the source said per your suggestion, see Special:Diff/872984527. Do you have any more issues or will you go ahead and request a new review for someone uninvolved to approve ALT3 (which you call ALT4 here)?--SkyGazer 512 Oh no, what did I do this time? 13:50, 10 December 2018 (UTC)
As mentioned above, I'm requesting a new reviewer to see if ALT3 is good or if any of the other proposed hooks are better. Symbol redirect vote 4.svg Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 14:18, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

Israeli occupation of the West bank

  • ... that the Israeli occupation of the West Bank, along with the Gaza Strip, is the longest military occupation in modern times? Source: "The Israeli occupation of the West Bank and Gaza is the longest military occupation in modern times"
    • ALT1:... that under the Israeli occupation of the West Bank Palestinian Arabs are governed under military law and Israeli Jews under civilian law? Source: "From the occupation's very beginning, the ethnicity of the individual determined both the legal system to which a person would be subjected as well as whether the letter of the law would be enforced at all. Whereas both the land and its Palestinian inhabitants have been subjected to military rule, the Jewish settlers who took over the expropriated land have been subjected to Israeli civilian law."

Converted from a redirect by Nishidani (talk), Nableezy (talk), and NSH001 (talk). Nominated by Nableezy (talk) at 01:47, 28 November 2018 (UTC).

William Montgemerie

Created by Spinningspark (talk). Self-nominated at 17:56, 27 November 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on November 28

Gwen Grant Mellon

Created by Wuerzele (talk). Self-nominated at 20:34, 28 November 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on November 29

Sammy Woodhouse

Created by Wumbolo (talk). Self-nominated at 20:21, 5 December 2018 (UTC).

Shekhar: Ek Jivani

  • ... that the first psychoanalytic novel in Hindi literature was Shekhar: Ek Jivani by Agyeya? Source: Shingavi, Snehal (2016). "Agyeya's Unfinished Revolution: Sexual and Social Freedom in Shekhar: Ek Jivani". Journal of South Asian Studies. 39 (3): 577–591.

Created by Gazal world (talk). Self-nominated at 16:54, 4 December 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol delete vote.svg not in time, page was created on November 29, 2018 and was not expanded 5x . FitIndia Talk 17:16, 4 December 2018 (UTC)
Symbol redirect vote 4.svg DYK rules state a 7-day limit, and this was nominated on December 4 meaning it's still within the allowed timeframe. In addition, this is a new DYK editor and we're usually more lenient on new nominators. With that said, the article has a big "copyedit" tag on it, which needs to be resolved before this can be approved. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 11:48, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
I have requested on GOCE for copyediting. Thanks. -Gazal world (talk) 12:49, 5 December 2018 (UTC)

David Long (American football)

Created by TonyTheTiger (talk). Self-nominated at 20:35, 6 December 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on November 30

Hamdan Qarmat

Created by Cplakidas (talk). Self-nominated at 15:37, 1 December 2018 (UTC).

Cyclonic Niño

A typhoon in 2003
A typhoon in 2003

Moved to mainspace by Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk). Self-nominated at 17:48, 30 November 2018 (UTC).

David Long Jr.

Created by TonyTheTiger (talk). Self-nominated at 16:13, 7 December 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on December 1

Carsten Koch (musician)

Concert on 9 December 2018
Concert on 9 December 2018
  • Reviewed: to come
  • Comment: would work for Christmas, 25 December, but also 26, 27, 1 January, 2 and 6, - the days on which the six parts of the oratorio were performed at Bach's time

Created by Gerda Arendt (talk). Self-nominated at 14:16, 8 December 2018 (UTC).

Diademed amazon

Diademed amazon
Diademed amazon
  • ... that the diademed amazon is considered "endangered" because the forests in Brazil in which it lives are being felled for soybean production and cattle ranching? Source: " The primary threat to this species is accelerating deforestation in the Amazon Basin as land is cleared for cattle ranching and soy production"

5x expanded by Cwmhiraeth (talk). Self-nominated at 10:55, 8 December 2018 (UTC).

Crash (magazine)

  • ... that the computer magazine Crash got into trouble when its front cover featured a staff member wrestling in a swimsuit with an alien? Source: "Controversial covers, such as .... issue 31's depiction of a swimsuited Hannah Smith wrestling with an alien, often saw sales spikes, despite the protestations of WH Smith, John Menzies and indignant mothers." [29]
    • ALT1:... that Crash was Britain's biggest-selling computer magazine in early 1986? Source: "During the period January to June this year, CRASH sold 101,483 copies a month on average — more than any other computer magazine in the country by all accounts." [30]
  • Reviewed: Josephine Heffernan
  • Comment: If we've got a lot of hooks to use up, it might be an idea to defer this to February, which would be the 45th anniversary of the magazine's first issue.

Improved to Good Article status by Ritchie333 (talk). Self-nominated at 12:22, 6 December 2018 (UTC).

Thomas Mulledy

Created by Ergo Sum (talk). Self-nominated at 19:27, 4 December 2018 (UTC).

Darwin Guyot

Moved to mainspace by Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk). Self-nominated at 10:35, 2 December 2018 (UTC).

Jim Derrington

  • Reviewed: Clémentine Touré
  • Comment: I wanted to make a hook about him being the last 16-year-old in MLB history but I can't find a good source for that.

5x expanded by JustJamie820 (talk). Self-nominated at 22:32, 1 December 2018 (UTC).

Earth's circumference

  • Reviewed: QPQ to come

Created by Onceinawhile (talk). Self-nominated at 18:33, 1 December 2018 (UTC).

  • @Onceinawhile: Symbol delete vote.svg In case you missed it, Long enough – the prose portion is at least 1,500 characters. Right now Earth's circumference is only 522 characters of "readable prose size". Umimmak (talk) 18:54, 1 December 2018 (UTC)
Hi @Umimmak: many thanks. I was still building the article - my fault for posting here before it was ready. I have finished now, but need to await the outcome of an AfD. Onceinawhile (talk) 01:00, 2 December 2018 (UTC)
@Onceinawhile: okay thanks for the heads up. Ping me once that has been resolved and I'll go through the review. Umimmak (talk) 01:04, 2 December 2018 (UTC)

2001 Harrah's 500

Improved to Good Article status by MWright96 (talk). Nominated by Kpgjhpjm (talk) at 04:53, 2 December 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on December 2

Ant-Man and the Wasp

Improved to Good Article status by Adamstom.97 (talk) and Favre1fan93 (talk). Nominated by Favre1fan93 (talk) at 05:41, 3 December 2018 (UTC).

Hook eligiblity:

  • Cited: Red XN - Inline citation needs to be directly after the hook.
  • Interesting: Green tickY

QPQ: Red XN - Not done
Overall: Symbol question.svg Waiting on the QPQ and the duplicate citation. SounderBruce 06:54, 4 December 2018 (UTC)

@SounderBruce: Huh? The source is right after the hook. There's additional info in that sentence after the hook. Still working to complete the QPQ. - Favre1fan93 (talk) 17:03, 4 December 2018 (UTC)

From section 3b of the eligibility criteria: Each fact in the hook must be supported in the article by at least one inline citation to a reliable source, appearing no later than the end of the sentence(s) offering that fact. Citations at the end of the paragraph are not sufficient.
I personally don't like it, but it's a bureaucratic procedure. SounderBruce 05:51, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
Well technically it is, since the hook starts the sentence and then we go into quoted material. It would not make sense to have the reference tag at any preceding period/full stop than where it currently is. - Favre1fan93 (talk) 20:08, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
It'd be fairly easy to just insert the citation after the comma following "Wasp" and keep it there until the hook is off the Main Page. That's what I normally do for situations requiring this (e.g. the hook being full in the lead and spread between sentences in the body). SounderBruce 01:28, 6 December 2018 (UTC)
I've done that (though I agree with you that I don't like that procedure). I've also done my QPQ. - Favre1fan93 (talk) 18:28, 6 December 2018 (UTC)

Greta Thunberg

Created by Gfosankar (talk). Self-nominated at 03:45, 3 December 2018 (UTC).

There She Goes (TV series)

  • ... that There She Goes is a programme based on Shaun Pye's learning disabled daughter, and some performances by David Tennant and Jessica Hynes were so emotive that Pye had to leave during filming? Source: "There were a couple of times I had to leave the set because David and Jessica recreated certain scenes so vividly that I did find it quite hard to watch" [31]

Created by Bilorv (talk). Self-nominated at 22:54, 2 December 2018 (UTC).

Clare Faulds

Created by Joseph2302 (talk). Self-nominated at 20:11, 2 December 2018 (UTC).

QPQ: Done.

Overall: Symbol question.svg @Joseph2302: Would make more sense to rephrase from present perfect to perfect tense (i.e. "was the vicar general from..."). In doing so, I think the years of office would be appropriate. Ergo Sum 22:26, 9 December 2018 (UTC)

Current nominations

Articles created/expanded on December 3

Social connection

  • Reviewed: I still have to review another nomination and will post this here once it's done.

5x expanded by Laurisela (talk). Self-nominated at 18:16, 10 December 2018 (UTC).

Ospedale degli Incurabili, Venice

5x expanded by Justlettersandnumbers (talk). Self-nominated at 11:39, 10 December 2018 (UTC).

Darlene Lim

Created/expanded by Tarselli (talk). Self-nominated at 18:08, 7 December 2018 (UTC).

James Stratford (publisher)

Fleet Prison
Fleet Prison

Created by Philafrenzy (talk) and Whispyhistory (talk). Nominated by Philafrenzy (talk) at 19:59, 4 December 2018 (UTC).

Added Alt1a. Did you get that he was jailed because he was bankrupt? I think it is interesting because we don't put people in jail for debt any more as that makes it difficult for them to pay. Philafrenzy (talk) 09:24, 6 December 2018 (UTC)

Bester Bube

The ♦J and ♥J as top trumps in Bester Bube
The J and J as top trumps in Bester Bube
  • ... that Bester Bube is a card game characterised by the promotion of two Jacks to topmost position, a feature paralleled in Euchre and other historical games such as Reunion and Kontraspiel?
    Source: "I conclude that Euchre derives from the Alsatian game of Jucker and that Jucker derives ultimately from Triomphe or French Ruff, probably via Bête. It is definitively characterised by the promotion of two Jacks to topmost position as Right and Left Bowers, a feature variously represented or paralleled in late 18th-early 19th century west German games such as Réunion, Bester Bube and Kontraspiel." at Euchre

Created by Bermicourt (talk). Self-nominated at 22:02, 3 December 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol question.svg size and age ok, written neutrally. free of copyvio. hook cited and faithful to source. hook ok. Lots of unreferenced lines (sorry, a rule of DYK). Even if all sourced to the one source (as I suspect they will be) there should be a citation in each para. Also, is there any more material on where and when it was played? Otherwise the substance of the article is pretty slim apart from rules (not a deal-breaker though) Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 11:07, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

Aadil Gurezi

Any advice or opinion much appreciated. Created/expanded by Farooqahmadbhat (talk). Self-nominated at 12:03, 3 December 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg @Farooqahmadbhat: Bearing in mind you've mangled the template here, it is usual for nominators to proposed their own hooks when they nominate an article for DYK. Can you come up with a suitable hook please? The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 14:46, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
  • @The C of E: Sir, I am very new to Wikipedia and still learning about its different projects. If you think that my DYK nomination caused any conflict in any way then i apologize for that. I submitted the said article for general opinions. Farooqahmadbhat (talk) 14:57, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
  • @Farooqahmadbhat: Not a problem, it us just usual that when the nomination is made, the nominator already has an idea about what they want as a hook from the article. From what I see, the article is within policy as the date and length are fine. It just needs a hook that you feel might be interesting to a broad range of people. Anything from the article could be good. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 15:06, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
  • I'm wondering how the image is really "own work" when it was uploaded 28 November, and I'm seeing other versions online from February and August.
    Other than that, probably something along the lines of Dupte Nunem being inspired by his mother's humming. GMGtalk 15:21, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
  • Aadil Gurezi - if not a hook at east a link, and I'd like to see more reliable sources before thinking about a hook. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:31, 7 December 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on December 4

Coldplay: A Head Full of Dreams

Chris Martin
Chris Martin

Created by MikeOwen (talk). Self-nominated at 18:51, 5 December 2018 (UTC).

Wilmer Clemont Fields

Created by Zigzig20s (talk). Self-nominated at 21:02, 7 December 2018 (UTC).


  • ... that the first discovered fossil of the dinosaur Weewarrasaurus was noted for being preserved in shining green-blue opal...?
    • ALT1:... that the first discovered fossil of the dinosaur Weewarrasaurus was found in a bag of opals by an opal dealer, and later donated to a museum...?
  • Comment: Author exempt from QPQ

Created by Lusotitan (talk). Self-nominated at 00:46, 6 December 2018 (UTC).

Hook eligiblity:

  • Cited: Red XN - n
  • Interesting: Green tickY

QPQ: Red XN - N/A
Overall: Symbol question.svg It's a neat article and a good summary of the source material. The hooks are interesting but do not quite reflect the two sources used, for example, using words that are found in neither of them. However, that is fixable. Of more concern is that the images used in the article appear to be copyrighted despite the CC 4.0 licences displayed on Wikimedia Commons. However, I am no expert on copyright, so would like a second opinion on that. If we can sort those 2 issues out, I'll do a final check and it should then be good to go. Bermicourt (talk) 21:01, 6 December 2018 (UTC)

I'm assuming the problematic word in the first hook is "shining", since the paper describes the opalization as "green-blue" in the "Preservation of LRF 3067" section, and it makes it abundantly clear it's talking about the holotype, which is the first discovered specimen (using "type specimen" or "holotype" here might be confusing for general readers, hence the wording change). Regarding "shining", the news article uses "sparkly", and I figured "shining" in this context meant essentially the same thing, so I used a synonym so as to not rip the description straight from another authors hook on the subject. For hook two, "bag of rough opal", "opal dealer", and "...donated to the Australian Opal Center, a Lightning Ridge museum...". Not sure what else in these hooks could be not reflecting the sources, it just leaves "noted" and "found" which are very obviously implied actions in both sources. Regarding the images, I'm reasonably certain all images published through PeerJ papers are good for Wikipedia use, but licensing isn't my strongsuit. Paging IJReid to help clear things up. Lusotitan (Talk | Contributions) 01:31, 7 December 2018 (UTC)
Symbol possible vote.svg Having taking advice here it seems that the images are freely licensed on the original website, so that problem has gone away. However, there are doubts about whether the principle source is WP:RS and also that the discovery is WP:TOOSOON to be accepted in the scientific field. That being the case, we shouldn't really be showcasing it on the main page. So I don't feel able to sign this off, but I've left it as a "maybe" rather than a "no" in order to give other more expert editors an opportunity to comment. Bermicourt (talk) 21:08, 7 December 2018 (UTC)
I would dispute on both points. Palaeontology is a field of study where quality secondary sources are not available in the vast majority of cases. Published papers are considered the standard for reliable sources in WP:DINO. Regarding it being "too soon", it being preserved in opal is factual. The part that could be not accepted in the field is the existence of Weewarrasaurus as a valid, non-dubious taxon. But if it was considered dubious in a later study, the page would continue existing (dubious species still get their own pages most of the time, like with the relevant Fulgurotherium) and its status as a fossil preserved in opal and found in a bag of them would not change. Lusotitan (Talk | Contributions) 21:26, 7 December 2018 (UTC)

Soultaker (film)

Improved to Good Article status by GamerPro64 (talk). Self-nominated at 17:45, 5 December 2018 (UTC).

  • The page has become a good article within the past seven days and the hook is long enough (I think the first hook is the most interesting, the second is a bit boring and the third perhaps not neutral, may perhaps be seen as promoting the film).MikeOwen discuss 19:29, 9 December 2018 (UTC)


  • ... that rivalries encourage people to take more risks and behave more unethically?

Created by BD2412 (talk) and GreenMeansGo (talk). Nominated by GreenMeansGo (talk) at 14:18, 5 December 2018 (UTC).

  • Source 1: After controlling for a wide range of factors that might also influence teams’ decisions — including teams’ general propensities for risk-taking, time left in the game, score, week of the season, yardline and yards to go, the relative ability levels of the teams (determined from ESPN rankings), and whether the teams were in the same conference or division — we found that rivalry between teams predicted greater risk-taking.[33]
  • Source 2: Across a series of experiments and an archival study, we found that rivalry was associated with over-reporting of performance, deception, and unsportsmanlike behavior. Further, we observed that merely thinking about a rival was enough to increase unethicality.[34]

Guêpe-class submarine

  • Reviewed: Cuthbert Hilton Golding-Bird
  • Comment: If I'm honest, there is no source saying that the class was named after the wasp, but I assume it common knowledge; the word "Guêpe"'s only meaning in French is wasp

Created by L293D (talk). Self-nominated at 03:33, 5 December 2018 (UTC).

Sarlacc's Pit cave

  • ... that the largest striped karst cave ever found has been nicknamed Sarlacc's Pit? Source: "The cave is the largest known of its type, a variety of "striped karst, which is marble interspersed with other types of ancient ocean rock, she said." and "The entrance to the cave, nicknamed 'Sarlacc's Pit' by the helicopter crew who discovered it, is seen in an undated handout photo." (both sentences from CBC article)
    • ALT1:... that no one will know until 2020 whether the newly discovered Sarlacc's Pit cave is actually the largest cave in Canada? Source: "The exact depth and size of the cave has not been determined... future exploration of the cave is being considered in consultation with BC Parks, and that a team is likely to be fielded in 2020. (from Canadian Geographic article) and "A newly discovered cave in a remote valley in British Columbia might be the country's largest." (from CBC article)

Created by (talk).

Three Lives, Three Incarnations

Created by Kingoflettuce (talk). Self-nominated at 16:21, 4 December 2018 (UTC).

  • Symbol possible vote.svg New hooks are needed as, according to Da Rules, hooks about works of fiction must involve the real world; i.e., they cannot be about plot points. Personally I am against that rule and wished it were abolished, but that's a discussion for another time. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 04:20, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

Eight Precepts

  • ... that the Buddhist Eight Precepts allow lay people to lead a life similar to a monk for a day? Source: "In the second place, this observance makes the Buddhist layman more religious ... He is partly leading a monk's life." (Tachibana 1992, p.66)
    • ALT1:... that during the T'ang Dynasty (7th–10th century CE), Chinese government officials would observe the Buddhist Eight Precepts and abstain from executing death penalties for at least a month? Source: "During the T'ang dynasty, the death penalty was not carried out in the first, fifth and ninth months, and many T'ang officials such as Po frequently fasted and observed these eight precepts during one or more of these three months, living in retirement in their homes and often inviting monks to their homes to take part in the observance." (Watson 1988, p. 13)

Converted from a redirect by Farang Rak Tham (talk). Self-nominated at 09:18, 4 December 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on December 5

Phascolosoma granulatum

  • Reviewed: EuroTrump
  • Comment: The thirty+ species names are listed under synonyms in the taxobox.

Created by Cwmhiraeth (talk). Self-nominated at 20:53, 10 December 2018 (UTC).

Michael McComie

  • ... that Trinidadian football player and coach Michael McComie died from a brain tumour 24 hours after being diagnosed?

Created by GiantSnowman (talk). Self-nominated at 19:30, 10 December 2018 (UTC).

White wagtail

Improved to Good Article status by Qwerty number1 (talk). Self-nominated at 17:23, 6 December 2018 (UTC).

Butterfly (TV series)

  • ... that when making television drama Butterfly, creator Tony Marchant aimed to dispel the myth that transgender children transition in order to be "trendy"? Source: [35] "if the drama does anything, it is to dispel two myths - that children are deciding to go through this process because it's 'trendy'..."

5x expanded by Bilorv (talk). Self-nominated at 22:49, 7 December 2018 (UTC).

Roberto Tobar

Created by Joseph2302 (talk). Self-nominated at 19:05, 6 December 2018 (UTC).

QPQ: Done.

Overall: Symbol question.svg Greetings! I took a look at this article, and liked what I saw. Here are my overall comments.

  • Hooks: I liked that first hook a lot; it may not totally have to do with Tobar, but it struck me as very interesting (and made me chuckle a little bit). While ALT1 works as a hook, it lacks the punch (and humor) of the main one.
  • Lead: For a short article, a two-sentence lead is fine, especially when it sums up the body of the article.
  • Paragraph 1: Everything checks out. The FIFA International Referee label is a little confusing, even though it's referenced, because I don't know why you'd need that label to work domestically. However, FIFA's site itself isn't clear on it either, and our WP article on the list's description (the one I've linked in this review) is the same way. Thus, I don't think you have to change it. Unless there's evidence that Tobar worked before 2011, which may be hard to come by, I think this paragraph can stand as is.
  • Paragraph 2: Looks good. You need to define which Reyes was sent off if he is mentioned by name; luckily, a search finds a Lorenzo Reyes playing for "La U" in 2016 and some articles linking him and Tobar sending him off exist on Chilean websites. One issue, though, is if you find a page that links him to the incident and mentions him by his full name, you'll need add a second reference, since the first one doesn't mention Lorenzo's first name in that article. I hope that makes sense; it's not a major issue, just one that is going to stand out to some people if they're trying to verify.
  • Paragraph 3: Still looking good. No sticking points here.
  • Paragraph 4 and final sentence: Reference 10 is missing the "s" in "Buenos". The actual paragraph is fine, as is the last sentence (I'm okay with that standing alone).
  • General: Individual Copas should be linked in the career section, and likewise with the U-17 tournaments and the Recopa. It's more specific, and by doing this you are also avoiding link duplication.
  • Overall: Solid article on an association football official. You did a good job not overly focusing on the negative aspects of Tobar's career (the tendency to send off players is noted in most of these articles), only mentioning them when it's important. In other words, it's an objective article, and that's a good thing. Once the little fixes are put in place, I would have no problem with checkmarking the article. Let me know if you have any questions or disagreements. JustJamie820 (talk) 02:46, 10 December 2018 (UTC)
  • JustJamie820 Fixed the wikilinks and also the Reyes issue. I wasn't sure which Reyes is was, as Lorenzo wasn't listed at the Reyes dab page- thanks for finding out. Joseph2302 (talk) 20:16, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

Motivation crowding theory

Created/expanded by W.s.campbell (talk). Self-nominated at 08:10, 3 December 2018 (UTC).

Like sheep to the slaughter

  • ... that a popular misconception holds that Jews went "like sheep to the slaughter" during the Holocaust? Source: Middleton-Kaplan 2014, p. 3.
    • ALT1:... that in Israel, Holocaust survivors were blamed for having gone "like sheep to the slaughter"? Source: Middleton-Kaplan 2014, p. 9.
    • ALT2:... that Jewish resistance leaders exhorted Jews not to go "like sheep to the slaughter" during the Holocaust, because "for three lines in history... it is even worth dying"? Source: Middleton-Kaplan 2014, p. 6–7.
    • ALT3:... that Abba Kovner exhorted Jews not to go "like sheep to the slaughter" during the Holocaust, to incite "a rebellion against the very use of that term"? Source: [36][37]
  • Reviewed: México en la Piel
  • Comment: The article's header image could be used, especially with ALT3.

Created by Catrìona (talk). Self-nominated at 22:27, 5 December 2018 (UTC).

Tomas Fonacier

Created by Arius1998 (talk). Self-nominated at 04:31, 5 December 2018 (UTC).

Chino Roque

Created by Arius1998 (talk). Self-nominated at 02:37, 5 December 2018 (UTC).

Never mind the fact that the tag is still on the page, so far Chino Roque only links to one other article -- as part of a dubious and unreferenced paragraph. Still doesn't cut it for me. You have to resolve it yourself, I'm afraid. Kingoflettuce (talk) 06:41, 5 December 2018 (UTC)

Kaede Hondo

  • ... that Japanese voice actress Kaede Hondo decided to pursue a career in acting because she did not initially know that the word "make up" referred to cosmetics? Source: [38] (本渡:小学校の時に校外学習があって、そこで通りすがりのおばさんに「あんた化粧映えするよ」と言われて(笑)。その時は化粧映えという言葉を知らなかったので、後程調べたところ「私は女優さんになれるんだ」と思っちゃって。それから段々とやりたくなってきました。)
    • ALT1:... that Japanese voice actress Kaede Hondo was inspired to pursue a career in acting after a childhood incident where she did not know that the word "make up" referred to cosmetics? Source: Same as ALT0

5x expanded by Narutolovehinata5 (talk). Self-nominated at 03:30, 5 December 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on December 6

Hebrew Melodies

5x expanded by Smerus (talk). Self-nominated at 14:27, 9 December 2018 (UTC).

St. Lawrence Island famine

Sketch of the Thomas Corwin caught in ice floes in the Bering Sea, June 1880
Sketch of the Thomas Corwin caught in ice floes in the Bering Sea, June 1880
  • ... that in Alaska during the 1878-80 St. Lawrence Island famine over 1000 people died of starvation? Source: "St. Lawrence Island famine and epidemic of 1878–80. The loss of at least 1,000 lives and all but two of the island's villages was a devastating event that is well documented in historical sources and archaeology, as well as multiple Yupik accounts."[39])

Created by Thats Just Great (talk). Self-nominated at 06:04, 8 December 2018 (UTC).

Dorothée Munyaneza

Created by Joseph2302 (talk). Self-nominated at 16:59, 7 December 2018 (UTC).

Growing Pears

Created by Kingoflettuce (talk). Self-nominated at 08:49, 7 December 2018 (UTC).

1975 Holton-Arms School Senior Prom

Dancing at the Holton-Arms Senior Prom
Dancing at the Holton-Arms Senior Prom

Created by Chetsford (talk). Self-nominated at 01:13, 7 December 2018 (UTC).

James Comyn

  • a woman once threw a dead cat at James Comyn, who later became a judge, when he was cross-examining her in court? Source: "You are strongly encouraged to quote the source text supporting each hook" (and [link] the source, or cite it briefly without using citation templates)

5x expanded by Atchom (talk). Self-nominated at 05:02, 6 December 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on December 7

Huadong Hospital

Country Hospital, Shanghai
Country Hospital, Shanghai
  • Reviewed: TBD

Created by Zanhe (talk) and Med Nyin (talk). Nominated by Zanhe (talk) at 09:54, 8 December 2018 (UTC).

Hook eligiblity:

  • Cited: Green tickY
  • Interesting: Green tickY
  • Other problems: Red XN - I would reorder the hook, so it reads: that during World War II, the Country Hospital (pictured) in Shanghai provided free treatment to Jewish refugees?

QPQ: Red XN - Not done
Overall: Symbol question.svg Just adjust the hook and awaiting on the QPQ. I am also assuming good faith on the other foreign language sources in the article (the English source for the hook is fine). - Favre1fan93 (talk) 04:28, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

HMS Sportsman

HMS Sportsman at anchor
HMS Sportsman at anchor
  • Reviewed: St. Nikolai, Kiel
  • Comment: ALT0 would be a very good quirky hook; ALT1 would be a good hook if promoted in the lead slot.

5x expanded by L293D (talk). Self-nominated at 20:24, 7 December 2018 (UTC).

  • Yeah, I like it too. L293D ( • ) 17:01, 8 December 2018 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on December 8

Wanda Harper Bush

Created by Dawnleelynn (talk). Self-nominated at 21:35, 9 December 2018 (UTC).

Alphonsus J. Donlon

Created by Ergo Sum (talk). Self-nominated at 22:30, 9 December 2018 (UTC).

Yocemento, Kansas

  • Comment: A source is also a plaque that was installed in the Kansas City Union Station in 1999, but since removed due to remodeling for the new street car line. Preservation of the plaque with intention of re-installation is confirmed by the Kansas City Museum's Director of Collections & Curatorial Services, Denise Morrison, 2018.

5x expanded by IveGoneAway (talk). Self-nominated at 21:59, 8 December 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on December 9

William Gould Young

  • ... that William Gould Young was the first faculty member at UCLA to be inducted into the National Academy of Sciences, and that their chemistry building was renamed in his honor?
    • ALT1:... that UCLA faculty member William Gould Young used his Priestley Medal address to discuss the changing landscape of post-World War II chemical education?

Created/expanded by Tarselli (talk). Self-nominated at 14:41, 10 December 2018 (UTC).

System 001

Created by A loose noose (talk), JC7V7DC5768 (talk), and ThatMontrealIP (talk). Nominated by A loose noose (talk) at 11:47, 10 December 2018 (UTC).

I had no idea. Maybe I should cancel this DYK nomination? I do not know how to do this. A loose noose (talk) 15:03, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

Avengers: Infinity War

  • ... that the ending of Avengers: Infinity War inspired the largest user ban in Reddit's history? Source: "The ban of over 300,000 accounts, which included Anthony Russo, was the largest in Reddit's history." (as found in the Audience response section) Source 1 and Source 2

Improved to Good Article status by Favre1fan93 (talk), TriiipleThreat (talk), Richiekim (talk), and Adamstom.97 (talk). Nominated by Favre1fan93 (talk) at 04:18, 10 December 2018 (UTC).

  • Just a comment, you accidentally Thanos'd WP:DYKN by forgetting to add a </small> tag, thus making the page not feel so good. It's fixed now. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 04:33, 10 December 2018 (UTC)
    • D'Oh! I was wondering why everything looked oddly smaller than usual. Thanks for the help! - Favre1fan93 (talk) 05:04, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

Jim Siwy

  • ... that Jim Siwy was a police officer before and after his career in professional baseball? Source: "...Siwy was selected by the Chicago White Sox, but decided to decline the offer and went to work for the Central Falls police department" for former, "Siwy served the Las Vegas Metro Police from 1989 until 2012" for the latter, both at SABR BioProject
  • Comment: I've apparently added an extra capital letter to Jim in listing this. Oops.
  • Reviewed: Roberto Tobar

5x expanded by JustJamie820 (talk). Self-nominated at 04:17, 9 December 2018 (UTC).

Ordos City

  • ... that ...? Source: "You are strongly encouraged to quote the source text supporting each hook" (and [link] the source, or cite it briefly without using citation templates)
    • ALT1:... that ...? Source: "You are strongly encouraged to quote the source text supporting each hook" (and [link] the source, or cite it briefly without using citation templates)

Created/expanded by Ordosnb (talk). Self-nominated at 19:04, 10 December 2018 (UTC).

Articles created/expanded on December 10

The Princess Saves Herself In This One

Created by Jisbell2 (talk). Self-nominated at 19:14, 10 December 2018 (UTC).

Policy compliance:

Hook eligiblity:

  • Cited: Red XN - no
  • Interesting: Green tickY

QPQ: Red XN - Not done
Overall: Symbol delete vote.svg The article does not appear in the hook? Hook not adwquately cited. Also contradictory information (is it 2016 or 2017?) and some NPOV ("very heavy"). No QPQ. 19:29, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

Voyage of the Sable Venus and Other Poems

Voyage of the Sable Venus from Angola to the West Indies, 1801
Voyage of the Sable Venus from Angola to the West Indies, 1801

Created by Dr Aaij (talk). Nominated by Dr Aaij (talk) at 18:58, 10 December 2018 (UTC).

Crisper drawer

  • Reviewed: forthcoming

Created by Chetsford (talk). Self-nominated at 17:59, 10 December 2018 (UTC).

  • It's fine--just squeaks by in terms of length (after removal of a trivial mention). Sources are fine, no plagiarism--but we're awaiting a QPQ. Chetsford, drop me a line when you got that taken care of. BTW, when was the first one placed in a refrigerator? I'm sure whatever was produced in 1835 wasn't in a machine like today's. Thanks, Dr Aaij (talk) 19:07, 10 December 2018 (UTC)
  • Plus, I wonder if we shouldn't add "humidity" to the hook; if so many people don't know how it works, then maybe they don't know that either. I wouldn't be surprised if you got a million hits with that. Dr Aaij (talk) 19:09, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

1971 Women's World Cup

Created by GiantSnowman (talk). Self-nominated at 17:01, 10 December 2018 (UTC).

Wilfrid Butt

Created by 97198 (talk). Self-nominated at 11:43, 10 December 2018 (UTC).

Special occasion holding area

The holding area has moved to its new location at the bottom of the Approved page. Please only place approved templates there; do not place them below.

Do not nominate articles in this section—nominate all articles in the nominations section above, under the date on which the article was created or moved to mainspace, or the expansion began; indicate in the nomination any request for a specially timed appearance on the main page.
Note: Articles nominated for a special occasion should be nominated (i) within seven days of creation or expansion (as usual) and (ii) between five days and six weeks before the occasion, to give reviewers time to check the nomination. April Fools' Day is an exception to these requirements; see Wikipedia:April Fool's Main Page/Did You Know.